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Foiling Out

 
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Mgoetz



Joined: 06 Jun 1997
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 9:03 am    Post subject: Foiling Out Reply with quote

Been learning the foiling thing for the last two years and have had decent success in flat to small chop seas but am having a hard time keeping the foil in the water in gusty choppy conditions. Most difficult is returning to the beach with following seas - even with feathering the sail and swinging my hips forward, the foil rises up out of the water and I come crashing down. Sometimes, the board slips sideways. I'm thinking a longer mast would provide more room to negotiate the larger chop. My mast is 80 cm and that's the largest that Neil Pryde is making. Has anyone solved this issue with a longer mast or is it just more time on the water? Does a longer fuselage help maintain a linear rider and prevent sideways slipping?
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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 5251
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2022 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

More water time.
Longer mast gives more room before breaching, but foil hits bottom sooner and requires chin deep water to clear bottom.
Turn and control ride height in big swell.
Same with longer Fuze. Less response to raise and lower the foil.
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boardsurfr



Joined: 23 Aug 2001
Posts: 1266

PostPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you open up the sail, you remove mast base pressure, so the foil will come up higher. Sometimes when coming in with big chop from the back, I do the opposite - sheet in when the wave pushes me up.

The one thing that definitely helps in bigger chop is smaller front wings (and matching stabilizers). Smaller foils are affected less by the up-and-down movement of water in waves and chop. Part of that is due to the higher speed of the smaller foils, but I think that's just part of the reason.
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LUCARO



Joined: 07 Dec 1997
Posts: 656

PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2022 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

80cm mast will work in flat water, but I like at least 90cm if there is chop.

Have you been shifting your back foot forward when you feel like you are getting overpowered?

Other strategies include weighting the back foot more, putting your weight into your harness lines to increase MFP and turning upwind more if pointing or downwind more if reaching
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Mgoetz



Joined: 06 Jun 1997
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2022 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the suggestions. I did try sheeting in and pulling down a bit with the forward arm and that did help. On the day I was struggling, I should have gone to a smaller front wing but was too lazy to come in and switch. I only have the small stabilizer. Coming in on the back of chop is still a lot trickier for me than heading straight into them - perhaps it's just the duration. Hard for me to break the windsurfing habit of locking into footstraps but am trying to at least get my back foot out and forward to keep the foil stable.
After sand bars that go out maybe 50 feet, Delaware Bay is plenty deep to accommodate long masts and I do think another 10 cm would help. Neil Pryde now has 5 different front wing sizes but their longest mast is still only 80cm.
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LUCARO



Joined: 07 Dec 1997
Posts: 656

PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2022 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if you could get project cedrus to make you an adapter for neil pryde that will allow you to use one of their longer masts.

Does seem strange that NP doesn't offer anything longer
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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 5251
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2022 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Longer masts start to flex, and a complete redesign, similar to what Naish needed, is the only solution. Naish went wider chord between 2020 and 2021.
Following seas, you slow down and ride the swells, turning to follow the angle, ride high when just about to step off. Need response for that, not a high, stiff ride. Longer mast just forces you to walk out farther when going out, and step off earlier when coming in.
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sailwave



Joined: 11 May 2000
Posts: 108
Location: Redwood City, CA

PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2022 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a 75cm mast and find that I have to consciously steer the foil down with front foot pressure over waves and chop to keep from breaching. It is my first season so mayube next year I will get an 85cm mast.
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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 5251
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't like short masts, but I wind foiled for 80 sessions with the 70cm., and now have 40 sessions on a 65 mast. Buying a 85 soon, Naish does not offer an 80.
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