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Gorge etiquette review: SHARE
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2517
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't pose, but I do park. You'll likely find me on the water,
but you can often find me having a tailgate beer and/or some lunch before another
session. Parking hasn't really seemed an issue this year. Doug's got
full a couple of times last week, but I didn't notice any whining.

-Craig
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 8822
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cgoudie1 wrote:
I don't pose, but I do park. You'll likely find me on the water,
but you can often find me having a tailgate beer and/or some lunch before another
session. Parking hasn't really seemed an issue this year. Doug's got
full a couple of times last week, but I didn't notice any whining.

-Craig


Craig,
NO BEERS, just LEAVE!
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2517
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll just chug the beer and go for another session.
But no stopping for pottie breaks for you, JUST LEAVE. (or pee in your suit)

-Craig

boggsman1 wrote:
cgoudie1 wrote:
I don't pose, but I do park. You'll likely find me on the water,
but you can often find me having a tailgate beer and/or some lunch before another
session. Parking hasn't really seemed an issue this year. Doug's got
full a couple of times last week, but I didn't notice any whining.

-Craig


Craig,
NO BEERS, just LEAVE!
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biffmalibu



Joined: 30 May 2008
Posts: 541

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure, there is no legal reason why anybody can't hog or be selfish in many ways. But why not make a friend instead? Like Elinor Ostrom, I believe common resources can be successfully managed without government regulation (more laws) or privatization.

There are a few river access spots that can be short on parking, whether you are doing nothing or just poorly parked (i.e. hogging 2-3 parking spots). My suggestion is to be generous and share, at least THINK about other people and the bigger picture. If somebody asks you to create a parking spot, consider being generous and making a friend. Or just be proactive and consider creating one anyway. Consider sharing.

For example, years and years ago, the principle of generosity actually was in action at the Hatchery. In certain sections, it was generally accepted to be OK to be "parked in" and "park in" others. AND people didn't "hog" parking spots. The principle of generosity no longer exists there, and the "tragedy of the commons" dominates. I am guilty of championing generosity and sharing over the power and righteousness of selfishness. The best argument I can make is that one should consider making a friend as potentially more valuable long-term (personally and socially) than the immediate power and short-term gratification of hogging.

This development in behavior at the Hatchery caused me and others to stop parking there, permanently.

If more people considered the overall benefits (personally and socially) of things like administering (and sharing) vaccines and masks over the instant gratification of personal freedom and that euphoric feeling of righteousness (especially as a "rebel" in a group of rebels) of doing whatever the hell one wants to do, the world (and the individuals in it) would be in better condition overall long-term. I'm digressing.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20712

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We must keep in mind these points, however:

1. Our parks aren't just for sailors. They're for anyone who pays taxes (or not) and wants to enjoy the park within its rules.

2. No one has any right to tell the next guy how many hours or sessions (launch/sail/recover) s/he can sail in a day.

3. How many times has any park been packed since we heard of Covid?

4. One man's "hogging" is the next man's "parking". A rig takes up as much space as it takes, and I have yet to see any sailor deny a request to squeeze in near him if there's actually room for it.

[Well, OK, two guys did scream obscenities at me for several minutes and order me to leave the park because I was parking too close TO SOMEONE ELSE for their liking. (The "someone else" didn't care.)]

There is such a thing as getting TOO bossy in a public venue. I had just cranked up the super-quiet portable Honda generator INSIDE my van at noon one windy, midsummer, kid-filled holiday ... i.e., NOISY AS HELL ... Saturday when a group 30 feet away ordered me to turn it off (I don't see how they could even hear it over the holiday cacophony.) I was about to defend its use (nuking a meal) until I looked over to find the source of the objection. It was half a dozen tree-huggers taking up at least 8 parking spots (the park and the surrounding desert were packed way beyond capacity) with their 40-foot motor home parked sideways in at least 6 slots and a steel picnic table they had taken from the park for their private party taking up two more slots. Behavior like that has gotten many a motor home kicked out of the park.

I hope we don't sound like either of those examples to folks who have every right to enjoy a public park any legal way they want.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10345

PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2021 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with generators isn't always the noise. It can be the toxic nature of the exhaust fumes.
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biffmalibu



Joined: 30 May 2008
Posts: 541

PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 11:16 am    Post subject: SHARE Reply with quote

Inconsiderate behavior (such as hogging) happens at various places in the Gorge, including Hatchery, Rowena, Cheap Beach, and Rock Creek. I am sure there are others. It's the Tragedy of the Commons, as well as a general disintegration of decent behavior due to modern events and culture (including tribalism, (anti)social media, etc.).

Isobars and others imply that I advocate only for wind sports enthusiasts. I do not. And I dislike when others put words into my mouth. I am a reasonable person. In fact, when a non-windsports enthusiast comes to a wind spot, I try to help the strangers so that nobody gets hurt or in a fight. This includes all the sites I have listed and more. There are legit reasons. Not all sites are the same. Some sites have higher risk for hazards like fire and crashes, for example. And some have very limited parking that must be shared and used appropriately.

I'm encouraging what used to be normal behavior (namely generosity and sharing), from the days when more people than not had manners that were trained into them by their parents and schools. It's obvious that manners and decent behavior have dwindled gradually over decades and maybe more rapidly recently. Additionally, due to tribalism, (anti)social media, anxiety, poor leadership role models (think "orange"), isolation, etc. people are losing (or have lost) the ability to communicate verbally and/or are more prone to overreacting when interpersonal encounters happen.

Show the world that USA is not yet dead, when it comes to kindness and generosity: SHARE.


Last edited by biffmalibu on Wed Aug 18, 2021 12:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bobsmithna



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 9:53 am    Post subject: Well said, Biff! Reply with quote

Well said, Biff!
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SynergyRehab



Joined: 05 Apr 2000
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flip flops, parking, chugging beers between sessions, huh? Unimportant and silly, compared with Biff’s original safety ideas. One thing which could be discussed is the concept of Surf Rules, versus strict adherence to Sailing Right of Way, or nothing at all (newbies, no idea, out if control, etc.). Basically, if someone clearly has a wave, get the F out of their way! Don’t drop-in, cut them off, and even take a wave beat-down to avoid collisions. This has worked forever at super-crowded surf breaks for years, and until recently, has worked fairly-well for us in The Gorge. With all of the newer craft/riders on the water (and crazy up-wind abilities) it seems like we could all use a refresher course in these Surf Rules to mitigate wave hassles, collisions and no bueno on-beach “re-education” seminars.
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biffmalibu



Joined: 30 May 2008
Posts: 541

PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2021 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sharing applies to swell-riding. It's been addressed before. I agree it deserves a refresher. So many windsurfers, kiters, etc. have never surfed! Look upwind, let the swell-surfer ride. Why? Because 1) they are underpowered and consequently less-able to avoid than you (the fully-powered). 1.5 corollary) I guarantee you the swell-rider is tireder than you (relaxing in your harness lines) are. Do you really want to take a chance with a tired swell-rider dodging YOU? While underpowered? Just look downwind and bear off hard. Or pick a safe distance away, unhook, and start surfing yourself. There is often space. And it's very fun to share a party wave (if you are unhooked and in control). And 2) the point of big swell is to do something with it. And that is to surf it. It is a tautology. 3) Esthetics=morality. Wasting a surfable swell by running someone off it is a capital offense, an offense against humanity and a crime against beauty.

Look upwind. A lot. Especially on big fat days. And give way to the swell-surfer who is having a good time doing something underpowered yet a lot of fun.



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