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In the market for an 11m or 12m sail?
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rtz



Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 291
Location: Oklahoma City

PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:11 pm    Post subject: In the market for an 11m or 12m sail? Reply with quote

Brand new 2012 for $199:

https://liquidsurfandsail.com/closeout-used-sails/

Let me know if you pick them up. I'm wondering how they are still around given the year model?
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 934

PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because nobody wants 11-12m race sails. Especially not that particular era of Warp which was a mast breaker. I got one for free that I'm not going to use for that reason.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3926

PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a Maui Sails TR3 race sail - 11.0, also the Maui Sails 520 100% carbon mast.

Great shape but many years old. Sail is free, you just have to buy the mast for ? Your offer? I am on the east coast - shipping could be a pain. More sail than I want to mess with at my age on my Formula board. I do use my 9.2 quite often for my light wind days.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20202

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the time you buy the sail, a mast, and a boom, you could buy a good used jet ski, one hell of a lawn chair, or a trip to a windier place. There's a REASON your chiropractor wants you to buy a rig that big.

Does ANYONE buy them for fun?

Successfully?

i.e., isn't the only reason for their existence to race for big bucks against other pros willing to own one?

Isn't their only advantage over a manageable size one or two miles per hour of wind speed?

Won't those very pros, running a 7.0, still kick the ass of an amateur running a 12-meter anyway?

Why do that to a perfectly good sport?

Can you imagine the disappointment of driving to the lake, rigging that monster, dragging it to the water, launching it, and realizing the wind on the water is only 8 mph, not 9?

Don't take this as criticism. Take it as it's intended: the voice of experience from countless other WSers who bought $#!+ they never used. Of course, YMMV.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3926

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I raced formula and used the 11:0 a few times. When the wind is steady and blowing 10-15 mph, it's a lot of fun with good speed. My issues is that I am 75, weigh 170, and the wind range for the sail is limited, plus I sail in gusty conditions, so it gets to be a handful at times. With the conditions I sail in, my 9.2 is much more friendly if it's a light wind day.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10055

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rtz, you didn't mention the type of board and fin setup you would be using. 11 and 12 meter formula race sails are very specialized, particularly given their focus on up and down wind course racing, so they can be quite a handful on a regular reach sailing more perpendicular to the wind. Also, you absolutely need to have the right mast and carbon boom to make things work at optimum levels of performance. Just getting these sails up and out of the water will require far more determination and skill than a 8.0 to 8.5m sail.

I'm not trying to dissuade you, but you really need to proceed down this path with your eyes and pocketbook open. To do things right gets into some serious money.
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 934

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know quite a few people who used sails that large for fun. Some even still do, along with a foil or longboard. This is rather common in the Seattle area which is known for an enthusiastic crowd of light wind sailors.

But I'm not particularly convinced they are required now that foiling has advanced so far. Plus if you are using any part of the rig which is the least bit overweight like a low carbon mast or aluminum boom then I think you lose all advantage.
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rtz



Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 291
Location: Oklahoma City

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I take my 9m FreeSpeed out in sub Planing conditions. Always wondered if a bigger sail would have me planing. If not I won't bother with the bigger sails.

https://aerotechsails.com/freespeed/
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3926

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A bigger sail will make some difference, but not much. I can pump my 9.2 on plane in 12 mph wind (small caps begin to form). With the 11.0, same deal with 10 mph wind, but faster than the 9.2 in 12 mph wind. The 11.0 is A hand full if the wind is over 16-18 mph winds. Pointing high and running deep extends it's range. Good pumping skills makes a huge difference with the large sails to get planing in lighter winds.

I have the carbon boom too. The entire package that I will not use anymore.


Last edited by techno900 on Tue Jan 12, 2021 8:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 16353
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The big sails were fun in light conditions—once you got them going. I loved racing with an 11.0 meter North because it meant the water was pretty flat and you could send it. At 200 pounds, I needed that to keep up with the smaller guys on 9’s and 10’s. I also had an 11.8 which was very fast and slippery—I was in the front of our pack with that sail—but hard to change directions and a bitch to get out of the water if you dropped it.

On a race foil, you can duplicate Formula course speeds with about 2-4 meters less sail. My most used sail last year was a 7.0, which I used when I would have used a 10 or 11 in a formula race. Foils aren’t as fast as formula rigs for top speed—but are faster around a course.
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