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Is my board too small?
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antonputman



Joined: 22 May 2014
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:00 pm    Post subject: Is my board too small? Reply with quote

Here is the story. I picked up windsurfing 2 years ago, got a Tabou Rocket 125 LTD.
Fantastic board but it did not perform like I hoped in light wind plus I was loosing control in high wind.
So I decided I needed a 2 board quiver. So I sold the Rocket and got an Exocet WindSUP 10' and a Tabou 3S 96 LTD.

The WindSUP is a great success, I think I doubled my water time, at least. OK it's a jack of all trades but so many times it's just session saver. I extracted almost 25 knots out it and I am getting into the waveriding aspect, something I was looking for after the fast but rather passive Rocket 125.

The problem is the 3S or better, the volume. I thought I should choose between the 106L or the 96L and (being greedy?) eventually got the 96L. Now it looks like I placed a wrong betů I can hardly stand on this board. I weigh 78kg and thought it was enough to float me and to still be able to up-haul. I can waterstart just fine and know this board is made for high winds, 25-30knots. But I feel very insecure on this board. I actually have been out on it only 2 times and it is a nightmare when off the plane, it just sinks and flips over. I am not capable to tack without falling in..

My sails are 7.8, 6.6 freeride and 5.5, 4.7 wave.
I sail in places with unsteady winds, in the winter mostly offshore and very gusty when coming in.
On top of that most of the time I sail alone so security is kind of and issue even if I always go out with a waterproof phone and GPS etc.

So now the question is, should I sell the board and get the 106L model? Or should I just insist and build my confidence slowly in the right conditions? I think I could finally get there but at what price? And how much time, giving that those good steady high winds don't happen often here..

Cheers
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2507

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You CAN uphaul the 96, but only in FLAT water and light steady breeze, from 7-13mph. You can waterstart in those winds. Anything lighter, the slog experience is partly underwater, but a skilled 175 lbs rider can slog it down to TWO mph whispers, front foot in front of the mast. Guys like Kevin Kan on here can uphaul 85 liters, and they weigh more than you.
NO CHANCE tacking in those sub 13mph breezes, you slow jibe with both feet in front of the front straps. Of course, a pro can tack in 3 mph, but we're not pros. When you slow jibe, you are using more of the board, so it's more stable than trying to tack. When you slow jibe, you also maintain some momentum, and that momentum keeps the board up higher off the water, so you don't sink.
When I got my first short board, an 85 liter, I went out in breezes down to 5mph and practiced low wind waterstarts AND low wind slogging and uphauling. At 155 lbs., close to the same float you have with the 96.
Of course, you can buy an old 110 liter board, less than 200 bucks, and keep it for one season, in addition to what you have.
Most important, where do you sail and do you know to judge conditions?
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adywind



Joined: 08 Jan 2012
Posts: 489

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"have been out on it only 2 times" -that's your clue. And selling the Rocket was a mistake. You got accustomed to the passive comfort of the big Windsup and made 0 progress in active and efficient sailing. You need to practice a lot on a SHORT board if you want to get good on a short board. Replacing the 96 won't solve your problems instantly -you'll keep struggling on a 100 and on a 110 if you sail the SUp only.
Here is my recommendation :if you have the money buy a 120 L carbon Freemove board /make doesn't matter,they are all good/ - it will plane a lot earlier then the Rocket , will have a better stability and the same speed and gybing capability . Use it in 10-20mph. Use the 3S more when there is enough wind for it to plane. Sail the SUP ONLY when it is below 10mph. Meanwhile read and re-read this article /it seems I'm posting it every day now Rolling Eyes /
http://www.windsurf.co.uk/peter-hart-up-and-riding-in-a-flash/
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 1392
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hate to say this, but too small for what? I have a board approximately
the size of your Tabou, and I ride it regularly in 15-20 MPH winds from
6.7 to 5.2 in the Gorge (it's my light wind board).
I weigh 180 lbs, but.......... I have been sailing for a long time.
I could uphaul it easily, but it's much easier to waterstart.
Then again, I can uphaul a 75 ltr board (thigh deep), if I have to.
10-20 is probably not the right range for the 96, unless it's mostly
closer to 20.

I'm thinking though, that since you aren't comfortable sailing the 96,
that it's going to sit around a lot. You should probably sell it, and
maybe get a board more in the 120-130 ltr range. I know a lot of
people who ride all the different sizes of 3S, and they say they're
magic. so maybe you just need 1 more board in the 130 ltr range ;*)

-Craig
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2507

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most boards in the 100-130 range are designed for smooth water and ligher winds, like under 25 mph, probably under 22.
Only one I know you can pick up cheap is the Fanatic Shark. Older Veloce's qualify, but are incredibly long, and could use a nose job of 18". Those two, in 120 sizing, can hande rougher waters and winds in the higher 20's.
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NOVAAN



Joined: 28 Sep 1994
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To answer your question is a big no. You will have the same issues on the 106. Its not he board, but your skill set. I have the 3s 96 liter. I come in at 170 lbs. I often sail it with a 6.5 Ezzy Cheetah in that wind range. Its not perfect but very doable. I also have 32 years windsurfing. I find it is much easier to do a snap gybe than a tack. But it is very tackable.
You need to get off the 10 foot sup and work on your short board skills if you want to progress. If not, enjoy the ride on the sup. That's the beauty of our sport. So many ways to have fun. If your goal is to get into the high wind aspect of our sport, I would keep the 96. Its a really fun board for the right winds and skills. You need a board that will challenge your skills but let you feel safe if the wind dies. The Rocket 125 or better yet the 115 would have been my choice for you. The new freemove boards are really good also. Tabou has a Rocket wide 118 that would be great. None of these boards will glide like your sup in lite wind. They will get you back home if the wind dies and fly when powered up....
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 15133

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Is my board too small? Reply with quote

antonputtemans wrote:
I eventually got the 96L. Now it looks like I placed a wrong betů I can hardly stand on this board. I weigh 78kg and thought it was enough to float me and to still be able to up-haul. I can waterstart just fine and know this board is made for high winds, 25-30knots. But I feel very insecure on this board. I actually have been out on it only 2 times and it is a nightmare when off the plane, it just sinks and flips over.

At 93 kg, 96L has been my BIG board since back in the last century, including modest winds in inland lakes. In reliable 20 knots I was happy on 70 liters long before I could jibe ANY board; no way would a big tub of 90 liters be my first choice in a halfway reliable 25 kts. Now that I'm down to 78 kg, I'm guessing my 96L boards will be reserved for holey 6.2 conditions hovering around 17 kts. And I'm just a local recreational hack.

Here's my point: your 96L problem is not the board; it's insufficient wind or time on the board. Find the wind, put in the TOW, and the board will soon feel like second nature, then even big. This is not a sport to be shy in unless your venue is dangerous.

Mike \m/
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boardsurfr



Joined: 23 Aug 2001
Posts: 648

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need more time on the 96. I have one, switch to it when the wind hits 18 knots unless it's very flat, and have no problem shlogging it. I'm 195 lb.

Getting more practice in gusty off-shore conditions is a rather bad idea, though, even assuming you live somewhere were it's reasonably warm in the winter. Your best bet might be a windsurf vacation at a warm & windy spot to get more time in on smaller boards. Some instruction there would also help; a few tips from a good instructor can make using smaller boards a lot easier.

For now, the jump from your SUP to the 96 is too big. Going to the 106 won't make much of a difference; you'd have to go to the 116 before coming in in gusty offshore conditions becomes noticeably easier. You may be better off with a used board in the 115-130 l range. But keep the 96 - with a bit more practice and skills, it will be a great board for 16 knots and more.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1674

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It all comes down to wind conditions. If it is gusty lake conditions, a 96 liter board is a pain in the ass for average short board sailors if the wind has 10 mph holes that last a minute or more. I weight 77kg and use a 105 liter board as my smallest board on lakes because I can uphaul it if needed. I just ordered a 3S, 96 liter to replace my really old Tiga 263, but I will not use the 3S for lake sailing. Outer Banks only.
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antonputman



Joined: 22 May 2014
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the help and advise guys! Some good ones here.
Off course I understand my problem is not the board but my skills..

OK I am putting the 3S up for sale. I know I should keep it but I can only have 2 boards, unfortunately.
The 125L Rocket was a blast in her middle range. I got the low range sorted now with the WindsSUP but anything in the upper 25 knots (30 mph) did not work as it was too difficult to control, the nose lifting and board flying or bumping around in the chop etc.

So basically I would need something between the 125L Rocket and the 96L 3S. Between a Freeride and a FreeStyleWave. Is that where the new Freemove breed fits in than? But I need the board to work in higher winds than the typically 120L's. About 20-35 knots (23-40 mph) for my 6.6, 5.5, 4.7 sails.
That means I should look at the smaller 100-110L Freemoves, under 75cm width. Like: RRD FireMove V2 102, JP Magic Ride 104, Fanatic Gecko 105, Tabou Rocket Wide 108, Starboard Atom IQ 110
Will 110L of volume be enough? I think so. The added width will surely help staying on the board and uphauling because it's those 2 I have an issue with. I aint sailing out on a board that I have to swim home!!
And you can tell me how you can uphaul your 60L board and waterstart in 10 knot's well I can't, it's only 2 years that I own my own windsurf boards..

What are the disadvantages of those thin, short 'n wide freemoves btw? I imagine the benefits come with a price.
I am not sure but are these boards not designed for lakes and light/medium winds?
And what about a "classic" 115L Rocket or a 116L 3S?? If I could just have some more upper range and control than I had on my 125 Rocket I would be happy!
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