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paulf.



Joined: 21 Mar 1996
Posts: 303

PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WTF?
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rswabsin



Joined: 14 May 2000
Posts: 202
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iso,

It's a real bad situation along the barrier islands and most of the NJ coast line in general. Basiaclly the government has taken over the towns immediatey along the coast and are only letting residents in during daylight hours only - then they have to leave. Most town arenot letting the residents back in to rebuild for several months or longer. There are numerous state troopers (many from out of state) and national guard patrolling these areas and keeping everyone out. The reason is in part to keep out looters but more so becaue the towns are that f'd up with damage. I just read that Long Beach Island will be closed for six months to allow for the infrastructure to be reconstructed - roads, telephone poles, sewers - the hole bit - but first the have to clear away the damaged and condemned homes and there are thousands of them. Most of the barrier island towns are so heavily damaged that they are replanning the lay out of the cities and they are telling residents to hold off on reconstruction plans until the new building codes and city layout is thought through. Basically the entire coast line in NJ from the Raritan Bay (bay south of Manhattan), Sandy Hook (northern tip of our coast line) and down to Atlantic City is closed to the public - this is due to level of destruction from the storm. If you go onto the beach, you will be ticketed and escorted out of the area or arrested if you argue - basically it's Marshall Law. So it's virtually impossible to get near any of the coast line to surf or windsurf - even if you can get there - there are so many people really suffering from the losses that it's not right from a moral perspective - at least not right now. The other issue is many of the back bays we sail in during the fall and winter are heavily contaminted with sewage and fuel spills from teh numerous boats that were sunk or stranded - there are litterally thousands of them - so water quality is sketchy.

The good news is everyone is helping each other out and progress has been made in towns just inland from the coast. Things will get back to normal but it's going to be many months - most towns therebuild process will take years. Until then, I'm gonna take up the offer to catch session in Deleware tomorrow.

Rob
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13309

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bred2shred wrote:
isobars wrote:
The burned and waterlogged rubble of a few hundred homes or a 200 mile X 100 foot rift in the San Andreas fault doesn't, all by itself, preclude WSing wherever one can find wind and water nearby. Nor does a statement in a newspaper.


Asshole.

WHAT?
I'm trying, based on decades of formally and informally fighting (or supporting) real and imagined land and water access closures all over the western U.S., to help people realize that not every dog bites. I've cited many types and examples of closures, from sweeping federal legislation right down to some dude's front yard on the banks of the Columbia River, which I've successfully averted (or supported, after due diligence) with all parties' satisfaction. How on earth can that be construed as something negative by ANYONE?

You're welcome to turn around and go home, without inquiring further, after driving 100 miles to your favorite venue and some drunk fisherman there says "Go home", or the "Please windsurf here" sign is gone, or a waterfront park is closed to camping for the winter, or a home is burning off in the distance. But why is anyone with a little more backbone, ingenuity, self-reliance, or willingness to get involved or help others an asshole?

rswabsin explained the local situation in NJ clearly and convincingly. No one's suggesting you push past a wall of uniformed and armed cops and soldiers and climb over starving and freezing storm victims to demand your right to the ocean. My post and and my efforts clearly and explicitly addressed the broader picture, beginning geographically and conceptually at the fringes of those officially closed storm-ravaged zones and extending clear across the country and across a wide spectrum of closure rationale. If everyone were sheep, few free nations and fewer races and/or religions would even exist, and we sure as hell wouldn't be allowed to risk our lives in such an extreme sport as windsurfing. It would be shuffleboard or nothing and we'd all be living in Fritz Lang's "Metropolis".

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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1889
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Fick is a politicized idiot. He knows nothing about post-Sandy reality of the barrier islands, or NYC or LI for that matter. All he sees is the big hand of oppression every time he sees a speed limit sign across the street from a burning school bus. No compassion, no demonstrated empathic skills.

WTF hardly gets to the level of reaction deserved. The windsurfing world will be a better place when he no longer posts.

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pete1111



Joined: 16 Apr 2005
Posts: 118
Location: The Dude

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YOU ARE A DICK
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13309

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I realize the F and D keys are adjacent, but I'm guessing that wasn't a typo, so that's FICK to you. Wink

Would you care to explain to WSers all over the county who have had access denied, officially or otherwise, why you're so dead set on stifling any resolution of it?

I don't personally care whether you or anyone else gains insights into solving such problems to everyone's satisfaction, because I've loved having the Hatchery to myself one windy midsummer weekend, Roosevelt almost to myself much of one entire season and many other windy summer days, very windy NM and UT lakes to myself, and many other such coups for myself and others. Just tomorrow I have private access to a site on the Columbia with 30-40 mph average winds directly up the river with air temps pushing 60 (I may have to put up with a shower or two, but the other 75 or so launches on the lower Columbia will be unsailable). I've gotten access for dirt biking in areas most bikers can't even imagine (Google White Sands, NM for one example) and some incomprehensibly beautiful hundred-square-mile areas no modern humans have likely seen, snowmobiled all over some major Utah ski resorts, had free access to a world class private camping site overlooking miles of the Columbia in the middle of the Gorge since 1985, windsurfed a 200-sq-mile lake the rangers said almost no one had ever WSed before, and persuaded a State Park to give me the key to an entire closed campground on the shore of a big lake blowing 40 mph all day. I've camped free, under skies with more stars and northern lights than many of you will see in your whole lives, in incredible spots for 40 years now all over the western U.S., much of it in areas like Moab, Yellowstone, and windy shorelines from Nova Scotia to Marathon Key to SoCal ... all via my own initiative.

You guys just threw away access to some great tips for achieving the same ... and MUCH more ... without pissing anyone off. You're some truly weird people.


Last edited by isobars on Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1387

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
I realize the F and D keys are adjacent, but I'm guessing that wasn't a typo, so that's FICK to you. Wink

Would you care to explain to WSers all over the county who have had access denied, officially or otherwise, why you're so dead set on stifling any resolution of it?
...


Fick, the coastline, its inhabitants and much beyond have been heavily damaged on a stretch of several hundred miles of coastline. There actually has been a disaster.

And there are real and many diverse reasons for hundreds of municipalities being concerned about
1. looters
2. damaged roads
3. unsafe structures and bridges
4. water quality - i.e. toxic run-off
5. debris in the water and on the shore (very dangerous, as we saw in last year's tragedy with Joe Rocco)
6. fallen trees and branches (power lines are mostly okay now)

Additionally, gas is rationed in NYC since major pipelines for refined petroleum products were damaged, many homes on the barrier islands are being bulldozed sine they're unsafe.

It just kills the mood a bit and, in light of these circumstances, most people do go "WTF" if they see us pull up at the beach to go for a sail. Plus, it hasn't been that windy lately - just enough for the 8.5 today...

In any case: when we go sail, we are guests of small towns and municipalities. There just is no "big government" we can talk to that manages all the resources we depend on. So we respect their dealing with the crisis and play by their rules and save our strength for another, better day.

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Last edited by feuser on Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:28 pm; edited 3 times in total
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outcast



Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 2312

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think what they mean is:

You don't sail here, so what are you doing on an East Coast forum?

Must be quite appealing to have a disaster thread that ends up focused on you. Really..... that's kind of warped.

Seriously....if you wanna help us with access, c'mon out and bring a shovel.

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outcast



Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 2312

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here you go Mr Fick.
Here is a beach that is "Closed."

Why don't you try a Blues Brothers shot across the bridge?



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zeppy



Joined: 22 May 2009
Posts: 120
Location: Brookline, MA

PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That would be very entertaining, maybe JE can lend him a clew view for the ride. Good luck to you and Crazyfingers with the cleanup efforts, definitely going to generate some good karma, wish I could have joined.
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