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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 13136
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just so NW can learn something about the subjects he paid no attention to in school. Venice is a city built on alluvium.

Quote:
The rivers that now flow, used to flow, and wanted to flow into the Lagoon include the Piave, Sile, Zero, Dese, Marzenego, Muson, Brenta, Bacchilione, Adige and the mighty Po itself.


The estuary has been altered in massive ways, and the fact that much of the land is fill on top of unconsolidated sediments, it has settled. Thus it is more prone to regular flooding, with or without sea level rise.

But I'm pretty sure your point was to post the picture and divert.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 13136
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The European Union's European Investment Bank, the largest multilateral lender worldwide, said it will stop funding fossil fuel projects starting in 2021 and intends to finance $1.1 trillion in climate-related work by 2030, helping the EU hit a 32 percent renewable target by that time. The decision is said to be in line with the European Green New Deal, a proposed $13 trillion effort. (The Wall Street Journal)
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19310

PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I parked my van 20 feet from the shoreline of New Mexico's heated Morgan Lake one evening in anticipation of a couple of days of strong wind. We awoke the next morning 10-20 feet out IN the lake, in water maybe 6"-8" deep.

Four possible explanations include:
1. Global warming-induced sea level increases.
2. The van moved.
3. The decades-old spillway had raised about a foot overnight.
4. The near-gale-force winds all night piled up the water at the lee shore where we were parked.

Analysis:
1. Sorry, AOC, mac, Chandler, and all you other clueless alarmists, but this was a thousand miles inland.

2. Never happened. The danged van weighed 8,100 pounds empty.

3. Nope. The spillway sat right where it's been for decades.

4. BINGO! And this lake's fetch was only a couple of miles long.

I bring this up because Venice's flooding is SURE to be blamed on sea levels raised by AGW, when their own forecasters and political leaders say the immediate cause was prolonged extreme winds piling up the Adriatic Sea (a 1,000 km fetch.)

Keep 'em coming, AGWA loons. It's a shooting galley of fear-mongering BS.

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 13136
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wrong Iso. I haven't seen anyone arguing that Venice flooding was global warming--I posted something to the opposite effect. Hysterical coming from someone who says we should read various sources--and then doesn't.

You haven't gotten any smarter--or nicer--with your medical mis-adventures.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 13136
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's some actual reporting on Venice flooding:

Quote:
Venice sits on thousands of wooden piles driven into the mud, but rising sea levels and heavy cruise ship traffic have steadily eaten away at the surrounding marshes and mudbanks, causing the city to gradually sink.


I added that when you load mud by building on top of it, it sinks.

Here's from Scientific American:


Quote:
The main cause of Venice’s flood was the counter-clockwise flow of air around a strong low-pressure system centered off the southwest coast of Italy. The low brought strong winds in excess of 30 knots (34.5 mph) that blew from south to north, nearly parallel to the axis of the Adriatic Sea. The winds forced a large storm surge into Venice, which lies at the north end of the Adriatic (Figure 1.) The flooding was exacerbated by pre-existing high-water levels in Venice’s lagoon, due to periodic rains that have affected Venice since early November, plus additional heavy rains from the November 12 storm. November 12 was also the date of the full moon, which brought some of the highest tides of the year.



The Washington Post noted that "...the flood event...resulted in part from an unusually strong storm..."


I've studied and published studies on the storms of 1982 and 1983 in California. The storm surge for much of the winter was between 2 and 3 feet. That is about 3 times the amount of sea level rise we have seen so far from climate change--but a pretty fair prediction of what we can expect over the next fifty years.

I think it is hysterical that Isobars and NW invent positions for "liberals" to have--without checking in--so they can call them names. You go boys.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3478

PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From a CBS new story on Venice:

Quote:
It has been a perfect storm of high winds, a flood, and a city that sits only four or five feet above sea level. But experts and some government officials say what's making things worse in Venice is climate change and rising sea levels.

"This is the result of climate change," Venice Mayor Luigi Brugnaro said bluntly on Twitter.


https://www.cbsnews.com/news/venice-flooding-in-italy-worst-in-50-years-and-the-mayor-blames-climate-change-today-2019-11-14/

From the Washington Post:

Quote:
Italian leaders blamed the effects of climate change on the rising ocean waters and swollen rivers that lead into the city, with the mayor saying on Twitter the city is “on its knees.”



https://www.washingtonpost.com/travel/2019/11/14/venice-italy-flooding-travel-tourist-sites-saint-marks-basilica/
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 13136
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Techno—there are ignorant people in politics. This may come as a shock to you. Sea level rise in Venice is 4 inches over the last 50 years. Wind and rain are a much bigger factor—as is settling.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3478

PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mac said :
Quote:
I haven't seen anyone arguing that Venice flooding was global warming--I posted something to the opposite effect. Hysterical coming from someone who says we should read various sources--and then doesn't.


Correct, but as usual, you ignore the problem of the leftist media taking advantage of every opportunity to tie current weather issues like the Venice flooding to climate change / global warming, even if there is no relationship.
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vientomas



Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 963

PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
Mac said :
Quote:
I haven't seen anyone arguing that Venice flooding was global warming--I posted something to the opposite effect. Hysterical coming from someone who says we should read various sources--and then doesn't.


Correct, but as usual, you ignore the problem of the leftist media taking advantage of every opportunity to tie current weather issues like the Venice flooding to climate change / global warming, even if there is no relationship.


https://www.foxnews.com/science/venice-suffers-worst-flooding-in-50-years-mayor-blames-climate-change
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 5945
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well that proves it, because the mayor said so. Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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