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Immigration and children
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 6247
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like the North Korean agreement , not clearly defined.
So, again for the record. Republicans support tariffs , and deficit spending.
Thanks Matty....
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3036

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From mac's "fact checker" post:
Quote:
The Pinocchio Test
The doublespeak coming from Trump and top administration officials on this issue is breathtaking, not only because of the sheer audacity of these claims but also because they keep being repeated without evidence. Immigrant families are being separated at the border not because of Democrats and not because some law forces this result, as Trump insists. They’re being separated because the Trump administration, under its zero-tolerance policy, is choosing to prosecute border-crossing adults for any offenses.

This includes illegal-entry misdemeanors, which are being prosecuted at a rate not seen in previous administrations. Because the act of crossing itself is now being treated as an offense worthy of prosecution, any family that enters the United States illegally is likely to end up separated.


Unfortunately, the right can't seem to get their act together, but...…….

As I posted before, there are options. Trump chooses to prosecute, which causes the family separation. The other option, as I stated before is to let them go and hope that you get them back for a hearing. I assume that is the choice of liberals, let them go and hope for the best. Any of you willing to acknowledge this or have a different solution?

All Trump is trying to do is stop the influx of illegals crossing the border. Since the wall isn't up yet, this prosecution seems to be an attempt to slow the crossings. So, anyone thinking that families crossing illegally with children aren't hoping that the kids will generate some humanity from ICE and allow them in, they have their eyes closed. The kids are pawns and get a raw deal when their parents choose to break laws and get caught.

If they know the consequences for braking a law, then get caught breaking that law and get prosecuted - they asked for it, they got it. They gambled and lost.
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vientomas



Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 272

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
boggsman1 wrote:
mat-ty wrote:
boggsman1 wrote:
OMG. Matty, maybe tRump is making noise to distract people like you from the DOW's 1000 point collapse this week due to $300B of new tariffs....



Down a thousand from it's record highs.......yawn

Trumps not making noise , he's getting it done.


Truly remarkable that Republicans support tariffs...a massive tax to the average American. A policy with a .000 Batting average..



We support fair trade, and are thankful we have a president willing to fight for it.


Fair trade is a social movement whose stated goal is to help producers in developing countries achieve better trading conditions. Members of the movement advocate the payment of higher prices to exporters, as well as improved social and environmental standards.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_trade
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 6247
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just seeing a Republican using the word "fair" makes me laugh... "fair" used to be exclusive to weak minded liberals....Republicans used to be dog-eat-dog tough guys who loved to do battle in the free markets... Now , they plead with the GOVT for assistance, and help....
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 10492
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Techno--this is a Trump created problem, in a number of ways. Opposing Trump and Session's cruelty does not translate to support for open borders, despite all the talking points you parrot.

I support asylum for those who are threatened in their home countries. I know many immigrants--including many in the windsurfing community--that fled oppressive regimes (Czechoslovakia and Cuba to name two) and have made America a better place. The pediatrician who blew the whistle on lead in the water and children in Flint is a refugee from oppression in Iraq.

There are provisions in the existing law that allow people to seek asylum. Sessions and Trump are so nativistic that they have scorned those provisions and violated that law in spirit and process. The details about how are readily available. Trump considers abusing children a way to get leverage for a right wing immigration bill rather than a reasonable compromise. In my opinion that is evil.

And the wall. An amazingly uninformed comment. The vastness and natural topography of our southern--and northern boundaries--make pursuit of a wall simply a waste of money. In California, there has long been a wall between the Pacific Ocean and San Ysidro. It crosses gullies like Smuggler's Gulch, where it is impossible to keep out immigrants and still allow water to pass. Neither Trump nor his besotted anti-immigrant supporters haven't given this any appreciable thought. A few facts for you:

1. The border between Mexico and the United States is 1954 miles long.

2. Even if a border wall were built, and was effective, it only involves a portion of the undocumented workers. Many come by plane, many overstayed their visas, a large number come from China.

3. The war on drugs is a pretty good example of how futile law enforcement is in the face of demand. We spend vast sums, and intercept 13% of the heroin and less than half of the cocaine. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/special/math.html

Due to demand, the global illegal drug trade is one of the largest businesses in the world. Fighting it has corrupted both politicians and police forces.

4. 60% of the undocumented in the US have been here more than a decade, and only 300,000 of the 11 million here have been convicted of a felony.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/03/06/us/politics/undocumented-illegal-immigrants.html

I expect Democrats to use this as a wedge issue to reveal what a liar and bully Trump is. I expect Republicans to continue to edit the inscription on the Statue of Liberty as follows:

“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
and I'll separate them from their children and put them in jail."
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wsurfer



Joined: 17 Aug 2000
Posts: 667

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah come on...Laura Ingraham says it's just like summer camp...except you can't go home.

Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah here I am at Camp Despota!!!
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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 4039

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wsurfer wrote:
Ah come on...Laura Ingraham says it's just like summer camp...except you can't go home.

Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah here I am at Camp Despota!!!


I thought they came from the worst conditions on earth.

Their safe, their warm, their fed and are being treated with respect by the most generous nation in the history of the world.......so STFU.

Obey and respect our laws and you can avoid this situation....
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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 4039

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mac wrote:
Techno--this is a Trump created problem, in a number of ways. Opposing Trump and Session's cruelty does not translate to support for open borders, despite all the talking points you parrot.

I support asylum for those who are threatened in their home countries. I know many immigrants--including many in the windsurfing community--that fled oppressive regimes (Czechoslovakia and Cuba to name two) and have made America a better place. The pediatrician who blew the whistle on lead in the water and children in Flint is a refugee from oppression in Iraq.

There are provisions in the existing law that allow people to seek asylum. Sessions and Trump are so nativistic that they have scorned those provisions and violated that law in spirit and process. The details about how are readily available. Trump considers abusing children a way to get leverage for a right wing immigration bill rather than a reasonable compromise. In my opinion that is evil.

And the wall. An amazingly uninformed comment. The vastness and natural topography of our southern--and northern boundaries--make pursuit of a wall simply a waste of money. In California, there has long been a wall between the Pacific Ocean and San Ysidro. It crosses gullies like Smuggler's Gulch, where it is impossible to keep out immigrants and still allow water to pass. Neither Trump nor his besotted anti-immigrant supporters haven't given this any appreciable thought. A few facts for you:

1. The border between Mexico and the United States is 1954 miles long.

2. Even if a border wall were built, and was effective, it only involves a portion of the undocumented workers. Many come by plane, many overstayed their visas, a large number come from China.

3. The war on drugs is a pretty good example of how futile law enforcement is in the face of demand. We spend vast sums, and intercept 13% of the heroin and less than half of the cocaine. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/special/math.html

Due to demand, the global illegal drug trade is one of the largest businesses in the world. Fighting it has corrupted both politicians and police forces.

4. 60% of the undocumented in the US have been here more than a decade, and only 300,000 of the 11 million here have been convicted of a felony.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/03/06/us/politics/undocumented-illegal-immigrants.html

I expect Democrats to use this as a wedge issue to reveal what a liar and bully Trump is. I expect Republicans to continue to edit the inscription on the Statue of Liberty as follows:

“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
and I'll separate them from their children and put them in jail."




Good luck with the wedge issue BS.... all you're doing is showing voters that liberal scum care about votes and illegals more than US citizens.....losing issue moron, but please keep doing what your doing.
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LHDR



Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 337

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It should give some of you some pause when Republicans in the Senate, quite the extremists themselves, agree to stop separating young children from their parents.

"Republican senators moved on Tuesday to defuse a political crisis by seeking passage of legislation that would swiftly bring an end to President Trump's practice of separating children from their parents when families cross into the United States illegally.
Senator Mitch McConnell, the majority leader, said that "all of the members of the Republican conference support a plan that keeps families together," endorsing an approach that would provide legal authority to detain parents and children together while their legal status in the country is assessed by the courts."
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/19/us/politics/trump-immigration-children-separated-families.html?action=Click&contentCollection=BreakingNews&contentID=67174660&pgtype=Homepage
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 6247
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
wsurfer wrote:
Ah come on...Laura Ingraham says it's just like summer camp...except you can't go home.

Hello Muddah, Hello Faddah here I am at Camp Despota!!!


I thought they came from the worst conditions on earth.

Their safe, their warm, their fed and are being treated with respect by the most generous nation in the history of the world.......so STFU.

Obey and respect our laws and you can avoid this situation....

please bro, they're, NOT their...Respect the language of the land before you lecture others on the laws...until then STFU!!! Laughing
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