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CALIFORNIA SEEKS TO REGULATE windsurfing
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Arrgh



Joined: 05 May 1998
Posts: 856
Location: Rio

PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riptide wrote:

Peter also told me that the bill, once amended, will be a public safety bill which will allow police officers to do breathalyzer tests on operators of sailboats WITHOUT motors. Apparently as the law stands now, they can only do breathalyzers on sailboats WITH motors.


Yes, we have all heard the stories of how drunken Laser and Hobie drivers are wreaking havoc as they speed across the reservoirs in the senator's northeastern California district, frightening the good folk in their bass boats, ski boats and PWC's. And when the sheriff boats finally catch them, they can't even give them a breathalyzer test.
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loopless



Joined: 30 Jun 1997
Posts: 368

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We share a lake with the usual suspects of bass boats etc. And the rangers confidentially tell us that they find us ( and the kayakers) as so well behaved and such a non-issue compared to the trouble they have with fishermen. But fishing is a very powerful lobby group.
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aeolian



Joined: 31 Aug 2015
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riptide wrote:

Peter also told me that the bill, once amended, will be a public safety bill which will allow police officers to do breathalyzer tests on operators of sailboats WITHOUT motors. Apparently as the law stands now, they can only do breathalyzers on sailboats WITH motors.


Sounds like a red herring / strawman / fakenews. You're telling me the police can't handle public drunkeness unless a motor is involved? They cite college students, drunken rafters, and general out-of-control partiers without any issue. This is a legislation searching for a non-existent problem.

Tell Mr. Ted Gaines his employers (us voters and taxpayers) would like him to find a better use of his time.
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gerritt



Joined: 06 May 1998
Posts: 569
Location: Redwood City, CA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speaking from the perspective of a criminal defense lawyer (off the top of my head and without resorting to any research materials - so I might be wrong), this is a probable cause issue. DUI for boating is a 0.04% Blood Alcohol Content (BAC) per se limit. Public drunkenness, or PC 647(f) requires a person be dangerous to themselves or others - it is not tied to BAC.

So, for our purposes, that means if you have a single beer and go sail, you are pushing your limits. For most, 2 beers will bring you to 0.04% BAC, but body weight and tolerance affect readings. If you test at 0.04% or higher, you will spend the night in jail, lose your license (to drive), pay hefty fines, have to go to mandatory DUI school, and see your insurance rates go through the roof. DUI's have traditionally required the operation of a motorized vehicle. Now that they are including sails and/or kites in that definition, you are all on notice.

Assuming this passes, watch out for those ambitious young cops patrolling our parking lots. If they see you drinking in your wetsuits, they just might detain you and begin a DUI investigation!

BTW - for any DUI investigation, you are not required to take the field sobriety tests (FST), or the preliminary screening (PAS) test - hand held alchosensors. You also do not have to answer any questions, other than to provide ID. This course of action will no doubt result in your arrest, where you will be brought to the station. Once there, your are required to provide a breath or blood sample. As a result of your arrest, your car (windsurf/kite kit?) is subject to impound as well, at the discretion of the officer. This course of action will also limit any prosecutor's ability to obtain a conviction, as you have limited the evidence to the observations of the cop and the chemical test result. No one ever passes an FST. Even my clients who go on to test completely clean. The game is rigged. The MADD mothers won and the defenses have been legislated out of existence.

I never understood sailing after drinking. Its a balance sport. Likewise driving. Its dumb, dangerous, and unnecessary. UBER is your friend and will cost you a lot less than paying the likes of me, the courts, DUI schools, and insurance carriers -- not including the property damage, hospital bills, and mortuary fees.

PSA over.
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Riptide



Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 258

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerritt wrote:
Speaking from the perspective of a criminal defense lawyer (off the top of my head and without resorting to any research materials - so I might be wrong), this is a probable cause issue. DUI for boating is a 0.04% Blood Alcohol Content (BAC) per se limit. Public drunkenness, or PC 647(f) requires a person be dangerous to themselves or others - it is not tied to BAC.

So, for our purposes, that means if you have a single beer and go sail, you are pushing your limits. For most, 2 beers will bring you to 0.04% BAC, but body weight and tolerance affect readings. If you test at 0.04% or higher, you will spend the night in jail, lose your license (to drive), pay hefty fines, have to go to mandatory DUI school, and see your insurance rates go through the roof. DUI's have traditionally required the operation of a motorized vehicle. Now that they are including sails and/or kites in that definition, you are all on notice.

Assuming this passes, watch out for those ambitious young cops patrolling our parking lots. If they see you drinking in your wetsuits, they just might detain you and begin a DUI investigation!

BTW - for any DUI investigation, you are not required to take the field sobriety tests (FST), or the preliminary screening (PAS) test - hand held alchosensors. You also do not have to answer any questions, other than to provide ID. This course of action will no doubt result in your arrest, where you will be brought to the station. Once there, your are required to provide a breath or blood sample. As a result of your arrest, your car (windsurf/kite kit?) is subject to impound as well, at the discretion of the officer. This course of action will also limit any prosecutor's ability to obtain a conviction, as you have limited the evidence to the observations of the cop and the chemical test result. No one ever passes an FST. Even my clients who go on to test completely clean. The game is rigged. The MADD mothers won and the defenses have been legislated out of existence.

I never understood sailing after drinking. Its a balance sport. Likewise driving. Its dumb, dangerous, and unnecessary. UBER is your friend and will cost you a lot less than paying the likes of me, the courts, DUI schools, and insurance carriers -- not including the property damage, hospital bills, and mortuary fees.

PSA over.


Last edited by Riptide on Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gerritt



Joined: 06 May 1998
Posts: 569
Location: Redwood City, CA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I just couldn't stand it and checked the code. Harbor and Navigation Code 655 defines Boating Under the Influence - BUI. Everything I posted above is correct except - the legal limit. Its 0.08% BAC for recreational boating. Its 0.04% BAC for commercial operation. Watch out Tony!
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Riptide



Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 258

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gerritt wrote:
Well I just couldn't stand it and checked the code. Harbor and Navigation Code 655 defines Boating Under the Influence - BUI. Everything I posted above is correct except - the legal limit. Its 0.08% BAC for recreational boating. Its 0.04% BAC for commercial operation. Watch out Tony!


Last edited by Riptide on Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gerritt



Joined: 06 May 1998
Posts: 569
Location: Redwood City, CA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In response to Riptide's link:

DUI/BUI proximately causing injury - can be minor injury and includes strains - is a felony punishable by up to 3 years. DUI/BUI proximately causing death can be charged as manslaughter and/or murder, depending on circumstances and history of DUI/BUI priors, aka Watson Murder.

DUI/BUI is priorable - meaning get #2, #3, #4 within 10 years of prior conviction and punishment goes up substantially.
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Gwarn



Joined: 22 May 2013
Posts: 25
Location: SF

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a link to the case
http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/justice.asp
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bert



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 547

PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now that recreational marijuana is legal in California I was thinking about smoking some ganja to enhance the foiling experience..probably not a good idea as it's as much an intoxicant as booze. Actually I haven't toked since my last year in college in 1972 and probably can't handle the weed that's grown these days Shocked


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