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School me on wave sails, looking for a 5.0
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 10:40 pm    Post subject: School me on wave sails, looking for a 5.0 Reply with quote

So it's been a few times now where we have days I can plane on the 4.7 but not with enough speed for great jumps or guarantee crossing the waves on the way out. When this happened, I came back in and swapped sails for a 5.4 power wave.

The problem is after the short boomed ultra reactive 4.7 (old 5 batten sail), my 5.4 (Neilpryde Alpha) feels like a cambered 7.0. It sticks to the water at the water start, pulls me like a rag doll in the gusts and keeps pulling at the bottom turn. Basically I feel overpowered while I was barely planing with the 4.7.

Also riding a 2008 acid 86l the board seems to like soft feet. With a heavy feeling sail it's hard to keep the rig straight and not affect board balance.

For sure on light days, the power wave sail is nice, when it's really big out with not much wind in between sets but for regular days I think I could benefit from having a 5.0.

Does this makes sense?

So I was wondering what type of 5.0 would suit me best. I love wave riding, like light feeling sails that can be corrected with minimal effort as to preserve energy. I weigh 150lbs.

I was looking at the Goya Banzai or Naish Boxer. Preferably no flex top to use with an Ezzy mast.
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SPQR



Joined: 18 May 2004
Posts: 214

PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Naish Boxer won't work with a Ezzy mast, it needs a much stiffer tip as Naish masts are stiffer at the top. I bought a Boxer and it is the one sail I wish I never bought, although I love my Naish Force sails and Naish boards. I'm a cruiserweight and even a 6.2 was about as gutless a sail as I have ever used. They are definitely better for lighter folks. Can't speak to the Goya sail, I'm sure it's a good sail.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 2437

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you are following the rigging guide, then the mast is incorrect for the neil pryde.

prydes require lots of down haul. sounds like you may have just not been rigging it correctly. BTW, the alpha has always been my least favorite NP, but tune it first before getting rid of it.

naish force is the remnant of the "lotsa power" culture stemming directly from robby's personal style. and, BTW, most naish's were designed around the powerx mast bend curve and stiffness. if one feels a gutless feeling from a 6.2 wave sail, then one ought not reward maui oriented R+D.

my charge 5.8 and phantom 6.2 are anything but gutless, unless i down haul the living shid out of 'em.....

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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3077
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a 5.0 Atlas '11, nice sail its a power wave.

I recommend a Ezzy TIGER, w/ 5 battens , these are great, durable, light weight (no matter that olde thinkers say) feel light, strong, A+ resale, cause they stay together.

Rig support from David is equal to none, yes others will help, Sailworks being one.

The most compelling reason which includes the above is :: it works like it should on your EZZY mast.

they are some other constant curve sails that would work, none so suitable as the the EZZY Tiger. If you found a used Panther Limited , its pretty close to the Tiger of 13/14

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kmf



Joined: 02 Apr 2001
Posts: 332

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are going to use an Ezzy mast, why not use Ezzy sails? They are good sails, and Windance has lots of used ones in stock for reasonable prices. Most sail company's sails are making good sails, but it is imperative to use the correct mast with the sail.

I think that a 5.0 sail is too close to your 4.7. You will end up being confused on which one to use. A 5.4 is the correct jump, but this is the reason why I insist on using a quiver of sails that are the same brand from the same year of production. They rig on the same masts, and they all feel the same when rigged correctly. And once you find the tuning sweet spot for one sail, the rest of your quiver is rigged pretty much the same way. A home run.

KMF
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1790
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure about your wind direction where you wave sail, side on, or side off, but if you feel you aren't getting enough power on your way thru the waves, getting a sail that's only .3 meters bigger won't be the solution.
You need to go out thru the wave at more of a down wind direction, you should be bearing off as you go out, you'll have more power that way. Then when you get out past the waves, where the wind is stronger (another assumption, not knowing where you are sailing), then you can change your direction to more up wind, to go where you want to go.
Same thing for jumping on your way out, bearing off before hitting the ramp straight on, will increase your power and elevation.
Keep the 4.7 and change your approach.

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5881

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It might be about re-organizing your quiver of sails. I used to go 4.2, 4.7 and 5.4, but then I changed to 4.2, 5.0 and 5.7. It was just a better arrangement for my conditions, and I liked the extra power.

If you get a 5.0, I'm thinking a DTL wave sail. However, if you sail in more onshore conditions, you might go with the power wave and just tune it to meet the need. It's relatively easy to take some of the power out of a sail. The dilemma these days is how many battens, but that's a totally different discussion.
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spot is Cabarete. Direction is side on mostly. Still I look for side when heading back. Rig is all neilpryde, X9 100% carbon everything. It sure feels light to carry but a truck to sail.

Really I don't have issues with my 4.7, it sails normally, can be rigged tight or baggy. I don't have lots of back hand but I don't mind. It jumps great. I have a 4.2 for rare days, no issues either, and a 7.0 which I don't use anymore, too much of a workout.

I tried to tune the 5.4 Alpha. If I have too much downhaul it loses stability and gets funny between gusts and lulls. I find it's better to adjust the outhaul. However too much outhaul and the sail gets stiff with no buffer. It seems that I can't really make it feel "smaller", almost like there's one setting. The pocket is always there.

I enjoy the 5.4 when going out on light 15 knot days and a 105. It's right around 18-19 knots where it starts to feel heavy and slow to respond but the 4.7 doesn't have quite enough.

I do head downwind to build up speed or simply pass a close out section, for sure I'm more careful with the 4.7 while with the 5.4 I can nearly always find power. It's when I'm really powered that I start having issues. Another example it's hard for me to build up speed as I have difficulties keeping the sail steady to "feed" its power to the board. Jumps are affected too since control in the air can get funny.

There are a few Ezzy around, with all of the white water trashing, it certainly is nice to have a well built sail. At least the Alpha so far has copied quite well with the abuse.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 2437

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMHO, ezzy's require more sail sizing, at least for my tastes. they are stable, and slippery, but at the expense of not much power. using a 5.4 sail in the high teens is a definite no for me though, anyway, no matter what the design/brand.

manuel, sounds like you sail in better conditions than me. try a sail size larger and put more tension on your NP's. they typically do not respond that well outside of their plus or minus rigging tips. also, sounds like confirmation of my view that the alpha has a very limited range. most prydes sail very well.....

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dennis_c



Joined: 05 May 1998
Posts: 652
Location: Rio

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The obvious: Ezzy 5.2. The not-so-obvious: hot tropical sun, steady ocean breeze, NP X9 430 in you pocket = Superfreak (not UL) 5.5.
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