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Drugs and the drug war
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5761

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars, let's hear more about your expert opinion concerning marijuana use in the state of Washington. Tell us about the first hand studies that you've conducted on the recent legalization of marijuana and its use, particularly amongst teenagers. Fill us in on how you got so up close and personal with teens to get the true inside story.

Teenagers aside, tell us why the voters in Washington shouldn't have what they voted for. With all your talk about government tyranny, and its dictatorial control of our lives, why would you advocate for a continued war on marijuana use and the criminalization of those using it? It was my understanding that true conservatives want a smaller government that doesn't intrude willfully into their lives.
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2380

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not the pot. To some, it's who smokes it.
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scottwerden



Joined: 11 Jul 1999
Posts: 210

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The title of this thread is "Drugs..." but the discussion here seems to be around just one drug - pot. I think a distinction needs to be made between pot and crack, meth, and heroin. Legalizing pot is the right thing to do, IMO. Heck, I voted for it in Washington. But crack, meth, and their kin really screw people up in a very bad way and while I do not think people should be criminalized for using those things, I definitely do not think those drugs should be legalized. While the war on drugs has not been much of a success, I think we would be far worse off if we had millions of methed-out, cracked-out legal zombies to deal with.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3322

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

War on drugs didn't stop them that much.
The drugs mostly did.
Cracked out meth heads have a short expiration date in my experience.
Don't have to die. Just fold up like rickety chairs or go to jail.

Most pot smokers wouldn't help the cops against other drugs because they were the enemy of potheads. In Holland the pot smokers dragged a heroin dealer from near a school right into a police station while I was there.
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2380

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The drugs you can live with vs the drugs you can't live with are pretty apparent if you just look at the evidence. Pot, psychedelics, and good beer seem to be the way to go...if you want to go at all. Gravity and torque are right in there too...but they can have lethal consequences if used recklessly.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5117

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are more than ten times as many who use marijuana--7.1 million--as use heroin (about 620,000.) http://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-us-drug-survey-marijuana-and-heroin-increasing/

I think it is pretty clear that legalizing marijuana, and decriminalizing heroin who, if nothing else is done, increase the number of users. It is also clear that a vast investment in the drug war, and imprisoning millions hasn't made a dent in the use of either drug.

No easy solutions here. I think it is worthwhile experimenting with legalizing marijuana and taking the profit motive out of selling it. I think taxes should cover administrative costs to minimize the amount that gets into the hands of kids, and cover enforcement of traffic safety laws to prevent increases in driving stoned.

If those are successful, it may make sense to de-criminalize harder drugs. But such programs will only be successful if there is a culture that discourages use, and considers it shameful. Whether or not that can happen is an open question.
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2380

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't ask Alice. Ask Huell Howser.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKTSa-NT5Oc

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frederick23



Joined: 24 Dec 2013
Posts: 399

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No easy solution is right. They will have a lot of new laws to figure out, DUI for pot? I think it is a fair experiment and look forward to some statistics in the case of Colorado. I used pot heavily for 8 years daily. Nothing good came of it personally, and who knows if Iíll get health complications. Having the threat of being busted, going to jail, seems like a fair deterrent to all my nephews and nieces from becoming potheads. It did no good for me. If it was legal and they could bring it to the Thanksgiving dinner table? A little weird. Especially if it was heroin. I think a good point about being stoned at work. When I was wasted, I could barely spell my name. I guess they would be fired though and put on the unemployment drug, which despite being liberal, I confess is a bad idea because it does promote laziness as was the case with me. If I took one puff of the stuff now, not sure I could tie the sail to the boom or even find the boom. Sex and Drugs and....
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reinerehlers



Joined: 25 Jul 2001
Posts: 958

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A couple years ago I participated in the Windsurfing Magazine board test in Hatteras. It was interesting to notice how many in the house"had" to let everyone know how they "had" to get to the store to get their beer / wine. A house full of 40+ year old, mostly professional, "A" type people and a lgood number seemed like they were still stuck in high school mentality mode. I can only imagine what that scenario would be like with pot as the alternative to alcohol. I sure wouldn't be bringing my boys along, or be participating myself if that was the case. I guess if you can't fight stupid then you regulate it, and hopefully profit from it too.....gambling being the perfect example.

I couldn't stand stoners in high school! I can only imagine how much I'd love a bunch of 40 something sitting around getting stupid.
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1925

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Reiner

Some of us enjoy getting "stupid" once in a while. A couple evenings ago I spent the evening on a deserted Mexican beach in the middle of nowhere drinking a bottle of Cab with my wife after a day of four wheeling across Baja. I will cherish that buzz, while I watched the sky turn red, for the rest of my life.

Moderation is the key.
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