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Help understanding Slalom
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2009

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KevinDo wrote:

The Tabou Rocket I used to have and other ones I've tried seemed to do everything exceptionally well. Not the greatest or best! But good enough for anyone who just wants to have a nice day at the beach Very Happy

-Kevin


It's not just about having a good day at the beach, but also about limiting gear. Many people just don't want to have multiple boards for different conditions. A good freeride board can be set up with 4 straps/large fin for blasting or 3 straps/small wave type fin for slashing/bump & jump.

If you only sail in one type of wind condition then a dedicated board is the call. But if you sail in multiple types of wind & water conditions & you don't want multiple types of dedicated boards than a good freeride is hard to beat.

Coachg
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 1279
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hypersonics were a very strange board indeed. I owned one for several
years, and they did sort of handle like mini formula boards. Killer
fast upwind, and a really locked in feel once up and planing. They had
dramatic bottom caves, which I felt helped planing, and holding a
straight course. I had the 133 ltr unit, which was good from 5.5 to 8.5.
Never had a board that short that would tolerate an 8.5.

You had to be really no-fear to ride that board right, but if you got
planed up, powered up, in the straps, up on the fin, and fully sheeted
in, the thing was fast fast fast, and fun. They cut through standard chop really
well ridden like this, but they are pearl machines on big rollers if you
try and wave ride them (I know only a fool would do that, but hey, I'll
try anything once, maybe even twice ;*) ).

I sold it (and it sold quickly), because straight lines just aren't my joy,
and Hypersonics are pretty unpleasant to slog(not that anyone buys
a board for it's slogability)

-Craig

rgomez wrote:
Thanks for the replies guys....The salom segment always confused me....The boards vary from narrow boards to wide boards and I've seen boards like starboard hypersonic which look very similar to formula boards with probably a lower volume.

I've come to understand these boards are ridden on the rails which makes it harder for intermediates to ride....but so are the Formula boards.

Is there much difference between a hypersonic and formula?
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sergio_k



Joined: 05 Jan 2009
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rgomez wrote:
Thanks for the replies guys....The salom segment always confused me....The boards vary from narrow boards to wide boards and I've seen boards like starboard hypersonic which look very similar to formula boards with probably a lower volume.

I've come to understand these boards are ridden on the rails which makes it harder for intermediates to ride....but so are the Formula boards.

Is there much difference between a hypersonic and formula?

hypersonic or Isonic? hypersonic was model from 10 years back, this board wa an extreme design, did somethings well, so not so, some loved it, most didn't.
Large isonic (~130l) will plane with less sail, jibe better, but will not point upwind as high as formula and not comfortable with sails >10.0
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2408

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hypersonics....
I was the guy who was banned on Starboard forums for badmouthing the Hypersonic. Took 2 years, lots of back and forth, mostly Ian being my enemy.
They kept saying it was god's gift. I kept saying it's a rehash of an old design (FanaticMamba) and that it was fast when perfectly powered, but slow otherwise and not a slalom, but a learning freeride board. I also said it would be OFF the market in 3 years. Took 4.
I have ridden it maybe 3 times, and have one in PuertoRico, the 122.
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sergio_k



Joined: 05 Jan 2009
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coachg wrote:
KevinDo wrote:

The Tabou Rocket I used to have and other ones I've tried seemed to do everything exceptionally well. Not the greatest or best! But good enough for anyone who just wants to have a nice day at the beach Very Happy

-Kevin


It's not just about having a good day at the beach, but also about limiting gear. Many people just don't want to have multiple boards for different conditions. A good freeride board can be set up with 4 straps/large fin for blasting or 3 straps/small wave type fin for slashing/bump & jump.

If you only sail in one type of wind condition then a dedicated board is the call. But if you sail in multiple types of wind & water conditions & you don't want multiple types of dedicated boards than a good freeride is hard to beat.

Coachg

Coachg, to previous response, I DO recoment newer slalom models >120l to intermidiates, and for beg-intermidiate for lightweights.

As to what you described before, I did do it for many years, listening to experts like you, at the end, even with the best boards/fins/etc.. and
relativly high skill level, freerides suck!!!
I spend lots of my own money/ and time on water to prove that statement, at least to myself...
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2408

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Possibly, for windsurfing in breezes from steady 8 up to 16, a dedicated slalom board is the only vehicle to allow planing, without needing an 11 meter sail. Most freerides, even up to 145 liters, can barely plane in such conditions, while a real 13lbs slalom board around 76cm wide will be smoking thru those flat waters and light breezes....and 8 meter sails. I've ridden even the FireStorm135 in those conditions, burbling along wishing I was on one of my old CourseSlalom boards 5cm narrower.
Formula works, though a big 10 sail is needed, not the best setup for most intermediates. I can't stand riding Formula, though I have for well over 40 days.
What makes the BayArea more complicated is that we might get some "8-16mph" days, but the majority is closer to 14-24 mph, and most of the lighter days in the "8-16" range can die off SUDDENLY, leaving you out in the water in glassy conditions, still with rolling windswells and the normal CURRENTS, which are not around everywhere else in the world.
So, while lightwind planing is indeed fun, like gliding over the water, it's usually not worth the effort because most of our BayArea days involve much stronger winds, and we need to still be equipped to sail on days like yesterday, when I drove to the ligh lightest winds I could find, Rod&Gun, and used my 4.2 with a 97 liter FREERIDE board...winds gusting around 30.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5894

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I've got a few slalom boards (old and newer ones), I also have a couple of Mike's Labs that offer a somewhat of a blend. One is a 2004 freeride/freerace that I would guess is about 100-105 liters, and another that is what Mike calls a wave slalom at about 80 liters that was made in 2010.

The former offers two front footstrap positions (I like the most outboard), and it's quite fast. One time at Sherman Island I was sailing on it with a friend on his iSonic (probably about 5 years old), and although he was on a slightly larger cambered sail, I could consistently catch and pass him using a camberless sail. I have to say though that the board doesn't feel that fast, and that's probably due to some subtle de-tuning to make it easier to sail.

The wave slalom is a dream to sail. It's got tons of maneuverability, handles rough water with aplomb, yet it's still lightning fast. Definitely faster than a freestyle wave, and quite a bit faster than my Open Ocean 80 liter. It has three footstraps set up with only one position, which is perfect for in the straps maneuverability. While it's not a true wave board, it's also not a true slalom board. It's a well balanced blend that excels.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1493

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rogomez,

Possibly you mean Ultrasonic 147 from Starboard. I sail formula but haven't been on an Ultrasonic. Word is they are more user friendly than formula, smoother ride, faster, easier to gybe, but don't perform upwind and downwind as well as a formula board. If not racing, the Ultrasonic would be a good choice for maximum light wind planing. We are talking 9-11.0 sails in 10 knots of wind, more or less. They are expensive.
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2408

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MikePercy is basically untouchable on his Slab wave slalom, around 84 liters. He's fast anyways, but really standout in the higher winds. I estimate 84 because he can uphaul it, even in rough water, and stand pretty easily with the board flat.
Deturned slalom boards are supposed to be easier to ride, so can go faster in rough conditions, deep waters, higher winds.
Was the "old Isonic" rider Jarek? On Maui Sails? Just wondering.
Haven't seen any of the ultra light wind slalom boards around NorCal.
Mike and SteveS have been riding 90 cm slabs for going up to R-2, Crissy, or just TI and back. "More fun, easier, can use much smaller sails and fins, jibe better".....
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5372

PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a new Mike's Lab 80 cm wide slalom board. I love it. It is really the first slalom board I have ridden big enough for me (200 pounds), and is a dream on a 7.8 meter sail up to about 24 mph. Above that a 6.8. Pretty fin sensitive--a big fin will let you go upwind close to a Formula board angle, but a little faster when you are lit, and a lot slower if you are not. Sailing downwind over-finned is a chore. But it is the first non-Formula board I've had in more than a decade that opens up the entire bay to cruising, while going over 30 mph if you have the nerve.
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