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Is BHO getting paranoid?
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 3961

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

boggsman1 wrote:
Spend 7 days in da Gorge, and Oregon Coast wearing out my 3.7.
Return to office to another all-time high on the S&P Very Happy
Bard...when was the last time you sailed Pistol River? Maybe the best sailing spot I've ever been to...and that includes Hookipa.


I'm at Hookipa right now, and the spearfishing is excellent. Just arrived today, and the wind should pick up in a couple of days. I agree there are better spots like PSC, Malibu, and Pistol. However, when it's on, it's really on. I only get a few weeks to spend with my son because he's so busy, so we come during the off season. Wife shops and son and I fish and sail.

Hey, Davenport's not on your list? I guess I had a once in a lifetime day there last season. Over mast high. In fear for my life.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3489
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Davs is great , but when Pistol is working its hard to beat. Its more side shore, better spacing,cleaner, and just huge!!!
But, at the end of the day, PSC is the best .
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1393

PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
I agree there are better spots like PSC, Malibu, and Pistol. ...


Malibu county line? I sailed there once and it was really great, but, come on...

Locals told me that, by dumb luck, I scored one of the best days of the season there (August 2010). I am not sure it compares with the best days at Hookipa.

Okay, let's get back off off topic...

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florian - ny22

http://www.windsurfing.kasail.com/
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5001

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When it is pointed out that repetition of ad hominem attacks do not actually constitute an argument, our British wag responds with a definition:


Quote:
"not having or showing the necessary skills to do something successfully"


Indeed, competence matters, which is why I am so confused by the inconsistent message sent in favoring amateur politicians whose qualifications seem to be a lack of experience and understanding of government. I guess that our infamous British public schools are stressing cricket and talking trash about cricket more than critical thinking and debate skills.

It is also useful to actually use words with some precision, and distinguish between disagreements over policy, failure, and incompetence. Disagreements over policy are largely a result of world view, and in the case of health care, of whether or not the government should have a larger role in health care, and/or should use the large role it currently has to achieve greater efficiency. Failure is, of course, inevitable in human endeavor, and is only fatal if you quit. Many conservatives who object to government efforts to create more cost effective renewable energy technology point to Solyndra in isolation, failing to appreciate that a certain level of failure is always part of learning new skills. Perhaps they have forgotten their own failures in learning to water start, tack a small board, or gybe?

Ah, but incompetence. We could actually have a real discussion, even a throw down about incompetence. A certain level of incompetence is guaranteed in governance in both America and England because of the spoils system. Each president gets to appoint a huge number of officials to important, and sometimes ceremonial offices. You can get an idea by clicking on http://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/nominations-and-appointments Since the birth of the country, people involved in the successful campaign of the president have expected to, and are, appointed to offices that enhance their stature. Some of them are guaranteed to be incompetent. In America, that incompetence can come as new money folks who made their fortunes in oil, or other energy products (think Haliburton) are appointed to positions where their lack of judgment outside their specific expertise becomes apparent, eventually even to the President. I guess in Britain we are guaranteed a certain number of tired old money peers like Lord Monkton. The art in governance is in making sure that the self-important but incompetent who raised lots of money are put in places where they can do no harm, and where their culturally insensitive remarks don't start a major war.

So let's have a discussion about incompetence. Certainly I'm sure that the Bush administration did not have a lock on incompetence, and a case can be made for incompetence in the Obama administration. But to show how an argument is actually structured, and is different from an ad hominem attack, I would suggest two high officials in the Bush administration.

Let's start with "heck of a job" Michael Brown, Bush's head of FEMA during Katrina. Practiced law in Oklahoma--high visibility training ground, eh? Ran for office and lost. King pin in the world of Arabian horses. Wonderful skill set for handling emergencies. How many ways can we count him a failure? Preparing for response, actual response during the emergency, procurement of mobile homes for temporary housing that sat unused, in many cases because they weren't needed and were suspected of high levels of But Brown wasn't the only source of incompetence, nor was it really accidental. Bush appointed Joseph Allbaugh, his campaign manager, to be head of FEMA when first elected, with the intention of dismantling the organization and turning it into a pass-through for funding to the states. (see http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/2515:part-three-fema-during-the-bush-years-2001--2004) Of course, competence at that policy would have involved understanding what FEMA did, and developing institutional capability in the States if in fact the Federal government was a drag on the process rather than a contributor.

But while that is stunning in incompetence, it isn't even in the same league as the Bush administration's efforts in Afghanistan and Iraq after the initial invasions. For the worst administrator of the last century, I would like to nominate L. Paul Bremer, who almost single-handedly turned a military victory into massive destruction of the infrastructure of the country and a long and bloody insurrection. An assist goes to Rumsfeld, who low-balled both the cost and personnel needed to pacify the country, secure its assets, and begin the process of reconstruction. Among the stunningly incompetent decisions, documented by the well-respected military historian Thomas E. Ricks in "Fiasco", were the dismantling of the Iraq military, the lack of personnel, either US or Iraqi, that led to theft and looting of many civil institutions like the universities and waste treatment systems, and the de-Bathification of nearly all institutions. Of course management inside the Green Zone was just as inept, and featured dozens of political appointees--sons and daughters of Bush fund raisers, as detailed in "Imperial Life in The Emerald City: Inside Iraq's Green Zone."

Now, that is how you actually make an argument, not an ad hominem attack.
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mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2552

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coming up next............the definition of "brevity"
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2587

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrgybe wrote:
Coming up next............the definition of "brevity"

Exactly right, and here's an excellent example, the opening post in this thread.
.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13861

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5001

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I said, the British schools are a true disappointment.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5698

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isn't ironic that isobars, who is a person known for lack of brevity, is seemingly speechless in his 20:48 post.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3489
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler wrote:
Isn't ironic that isobars, who is a person known for lack of brevity, is seemingly speechless in his 20:48 post.

Its even more ironic that , on a windsurfing website, he is posting when the mecca of the lower 48 is going nuclear for the past seven days. One would think his old van is parked at the Hatch , and he's schooling all the minions.
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