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1st and 2nd Amendments under attack
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4148

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 12:56 am    Post subject: 1st and 2nd Amendments under attack Reply with quote

Today, the State Department forced Cody Wilson (Plastic gun designer) to remove INSTRUCTIONS FOR 3-D PRINTED GUNS to be removed from his internet web site. In fear of our government, he complied.

I visited his website yesterday, and almost downloaded the instructions for fun. I wish I had downloaded them..... Crying or Very sad http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/09/politics/3-d-guns/

He is licensed by the Federal govt to produce the guns, however they are forcing him to remove the DESIGN ARTICLE. Amazing

What other Amendments to our Constitution are no longer needed?
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3385

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I was a teenager in the sixties, I was writing a paper on explosives. I went to the Public Library to check out books on how to make explosives at home. They would not let a loud month immature kid check them out.
What is wrong with these people?
I could have done a lot of damage with that info, if I had lived long enough to use it.
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rigitrite



Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 280
Location: Kansas City

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, let's take this argument to its logical conclusion. I have plans to create a thermo-nuclear weapon from a 3-d printer. You can make the centrifuge for enriching uranium, how to use uranium mining tallings for fissionable material, how to create the detonator assembly, everything.....not cheap, but anyone can do it. 1st amendment gives me the right to freely distribute information right? 2nd amendment gives anyone the right to bear arms....nuclear weapons are arms, right? Where's the problem?

The public good, that's where.

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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1482

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rigright said:
Quote:
The public good, that's where


Exactly, but where do you draw the line? Bombs or slingshots? Somewhere in between is a reasonable and prudent point, but conservatives and liberals will not likely agree on where it should be, so the debate will be never ending.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1950
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The guy advocates the downfall of government, including his own. He is an unabashed and admitted anarchist yet, despite that, the US government respected his right to manufacture his own guns and his right to sell them domestically.

What he did, however, is go beyond that. He published the gun design specs and methods with great specificity in a way that he knew, and everyone else knows, was intended (defined as "should know, did know and/or could reasonably anticipate") for oversees distribution. That very likely violates arms export control laws, the very existence of which is unrelated to either the first or second amendments.

Neither the first or second amendments are absolute. Tossing something into the air no more makes it a plane than publishing weapon design and construction techniques overseas makes it protected speech.

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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1950
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Double-post
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Last edited by DanWeiss on Sat May 11, 2013 9:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4148

PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So it is ok to trash the 1st amendment. Now I see how it is possible for the govt to tamp down freedom of speech. I never thought the population would be that stupid.

BTW, there are thousand of "how to kill" books published by the left. As a matter of fact, some of the most notorious left wing terrorists are college professors today.

ps, I do understand the implications of Anarchism. However, what he's doing may be for the good. For instance, it may render airport security checks useless. We may then be able to focus efforts on obvious targets rather than grand mothers.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1950
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2013 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve, I replied thoughtfully to your post with a basic statement that First Amendment rights are not absolute. You then replied as if I said nothing at all by writing, "So it is ok to trash the 1st Amendment." That's about as far from what I said as possible.

Take a read of the actual text. The very thing that creates those protections also limits them.

As well, limiting and expanding interpretations of the Constitution are a very part of it. Don't like that last point? I suggest you would've wanted to take it up with Chief Justice Marshall. He penned exactly that in Marbury vs. Madison about 2 centuries ago.

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5248

PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2013 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve--you might also look at some of the contemporary arguments when the Bill of Rights was adopted--eg. .http://www.ushistory.org/paine/commonsense/ and the Federalist Papers. They laid out the difference between liberty and license very clearly. The founding fathers were very smart--and they would be appalled by current politics and talking points.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3385

PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2013 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno,
I think there widespread agreement between the left and the right on gun rights.
nearly all of us ,around 80%,agree that background checks are an acceptable hassle to reduce the criminals and kooks purchase of guns. That includes most NRA members and GOP voters.
The NRA and Congress obey other masters.
Almost all NRA members say that we should enforce the laws on the books rather than write new ones.
The NRA focuses most of its funding on lobbying to strike down gun laws , not to enforce them.
I find many libs and dems own rifles.
The problem is the very poor, bought off leadership in conservative organizations.
they misrepresent the facts and drive Americans apart.
Divide and Conquered.
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