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The death of quality daily journalism
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 7723

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:39 pm    Post subject: The death of quality daily journalism Reply with quote

My grandfather, who was editor of the Seattle Times, is spinning in his grave over the deplorable state of daily journalism. Publications such as the New Yorker and Rolling Stone do more in depth stories, but the work on important issues done in daily news journals is appalling. The recent stories on Hillary Clinton's e-mail account and the EPA spill on the Animas River are glaring examples.

E-Mail "Gate"

Today's news shows that much of the right wing glee about Hillary's e-mail is self-generated and wrong. The State Department's John Kirby has now said that there is not, and was not, any State Department policy prohibiting the use of a private e-mail account. And Darrell Issa (the man who smiles when he lies) now admits that GOP claims about classified information in Clinton's e-mails is wrong because those e-mails were classified after she received them

There are two underlying issues here. One, the first attempt by the right to smear Hillary, involved allegations that she was somehow destroying records that would provide evidence of her misdeeds in Benghazi or somewhere else. It is hard to imagine a more important story than one that might determine the suitability of someone to be the next President, so some level of journalistic rigor seems appropriate. Any decent journalist would find out quickly that some e-mail records are government records kept in the ordinary course of business. Each agency is required to establish procedures for their retention, and procedures for oversight of the archiving and records destruction. To date, I have not seen any stories that established what the State Deparment's record retention policy was, and in particular, how it distinguished between records that were not to be retained, records that were to be retained and were publicly accessible, and records that were to be retained but were classified. It was always inconceivable to me that Hillary would be unaware of this policy, and would not have managed (or had staff manage) her e-mail account in accordance with legal advice. (For those unfamiliar, in California, under California's similar records act, records may be destroyed only with the concurrence of legal advisors, and with records kept of the kinds of records that were destroyed. I sent many boxes of administrative records to be destroyed five years after projects were completed and audits finalized.)

The claims that Hillary may have used a non-secure e-mail system for handling top-secret national security business is a much more serious issue, and might, if true, indeed provide insight into her suitability to be President. What is needed here is not wild claims by Mike Fick, mrgybe, or mrgybe's children that she has broken the law (based on leaks from Republican elected officials), but journalism. We know that there are elaborate systems for handling and keeping classified information secure. For hard copies, special folders and safes. Secured telephone lines.

So what did Hillary generally do, while in Washington, and while abroad when she had to receive or transmit classified information? If she exclusively used hard copies and had aides who handled their security, then this is all partisan attacks. But in the world of journalism when my grandfather was alive, we wouldn't have to rely on leaks from Republicans and Democrats, and ask who we believed. We'd actually have reporters that would do the hard work of finding out facts. (To be sure, if it didn't show a Democrat in a bad light, it wouldn't show up in a Murdoch media outlet.)
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 17466

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Journalism suffered a severe stroke when lefty "newsman" Walter Cronkite declared our victory in the Tet offensive a defeat, thus encouraging NVA commander Gen Giap to resume the war and kill tens of thousands more GIs. Source: Gen Giap.

It's dead, buried, and rotting in hell now that the vast majority of news media are staffed by something like 94% self-declared Democrats ... a major reason the infinitely more balanced FNC now often beats the broadcast news channels in the ratings. The media's Prime Directive is to hold the government accountable, not kiss its ass.
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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
Posts: 3527
Location: on earth

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
Journalism suffered a severe stroke when lefty "newsman" Walter Cronkite declared our victory in the Tet offensive a defeat, thus encouraging NVA commander Gen Giap to resume the war and kill tens of thousands more GIs. Source: Gen Giap.

It's dead, buried, and rotting in hell now that the vast majority of news media are staffed by something like 94% self-declared Democrats ... a major reason the infinitely more balanced FNC now often beats the broadcast news channels in the ratings. The media's Prime Directive is to hold the government accountable, not kiss its ass.


you are so full of lies as usual, do provide the absolute data on these so called 94% self declared dems. Note 95% plus of talk radio is hard core ultra right wing hate or religious right. Note nearly every major paper in the USA 95% plus is owned and controlled by right wingers that are partisan.

Note that there are 4 major broadcast networks, CBS owns a lot of talk radio and allows the 95% to be right wing with no partisan liberals equal . ABC also owns a lot of radio and allows hate talk and 95% plus to be right wing with no liberal evenness. NBC which use to be owned by GE for what 20-30 years a defense, chemical, medical, banking company just removed one of the top partisan liberals on MSNBC, as I speculate because he has had Bernie on more than any broadcaster in the last 5 years that he had a show. You would think you would keep the guy who has Bernies ear. The last is Fox which is the most partisan media in the USA with no top liberal ever allowed. Same with Fox newspapers, which are the largest in the USA.

You are delusional....

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when good people stay silent the right wing are the only ones heard.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 1047

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:20 pm    Post subject: Re: The death of quality daily journalism Reply with quote

mac wrote:
My grandfather, who was editor of the Seattle Times, is spinning in his grave over the deplorable state of daily journalism. Publications such as the New Yorker and Rolling Stone do more in depth stories, but the work on important issues done in daily news journals is appalling. The recent stories on Hillary Clinton's e-mail account and the EPA spill on the Animas River are glaring examples.

E-Mail "Gate"

Today's news shows that much of the right wing glee about Hillary's e-mail is self-generated and wrong. The State Department's John Kirby has now said that there is not, and was not, any State Department policy prohibiting the use of a private e-mail account. And Darrell Issa (the man who smiles when he lies) now admits that GOP claims about classified information in Clinton's e-mails is wrong because those e-mails were classified after she received them

There are two underlying issues here. One, the first attempt by the right to smear Hillary, involved allegations that she was somehow destroying records that would provide evidence of her misdeeds in Benghazi or somewhere else. It is hard to imagine a more important story than one that might determine the suitability of someone to be the next President, so some level of journalistic rigor seems appropriate. Any decent journalist would find out quickly that some e-mail records are government records kept in the ordinary course of business. Each agency is required to establish procedures for their retention, and procedures for oversight of the archiving and records destruction. To date, I have not seen any stories that established what the State Deparment's record retention policy was, and in particular, how it distinguished between records that were not to be retained, records that were to be retained and were publicly accessible, and records that were to be retained but were classified. It was always inconceivable to me that Hillary would be unaware of this policy, and would not have managed (or had staff manage) her e-mail account in accordance with legal advice. (For those unfamiliar, in California, under California's similar records act, records may be destroyed only with the concurrence of legal advisors, and with records kept of the kinds of records that were destroyed. I sent many boxes of administrative records to be destroyed five years after projects were completed and audits finalized.)

The claims that Hillary may have used a non-secure e-mail system for handling top-secret national security business is a much more serious issue, and might, if true, indeed provide insight into her suitability to be President. What is needed here is not wild claims by Mike Fick, mrgybe, or mrgybe's children that she has broken the law (based on leaks from Republican elected officials), but journalism. We know that there are elaborate systems for handling and keeping classified information secure. For hard copies, special folders and safes. Secured telephone lines.

So what did Hillary generally do, while in Washington, and while abroad when she had to receive or transmit classified information? If she exclusively used hard copies and had aides who handled their security, then this is all partisan attacks. But in the world of journalism when my grandfather was alive, we wouldn't have to rely on leaks from Republicans and Democrats, and ask who we believed. We'd actually have reporters that would do the hard work of finding out facts. (To be sure, if it didn't show a Democrat in a bad light, it wouldn't show up in a Murdoch media outlet.)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Translation; The leftist media needs to be pushed even further to the left.
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 3184
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose that mac's opinion would be exactly the same if it were a republican Sec. of State with the same e-mail problems.
Can't blame the media on this one.

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I don't drink the 'cool' aid, I drink tequila, it's more honest.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 7640

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess one might ask about the E-Mails from other Republican Secretaries of State like Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice. Are folks digging into their private E-Mail servers and all their communications attempting to find a smoking gun to what happened during their tour of duty? Certainly a lot happened, but why aren't Republicans or 24/7 cable news media incentivized to tear everything apart? Rice has even claimed that she never sent any E-Mails in her career as Secretary of State. One has to ask how in the hell she communicated to others in her role as Secretary of State. Of course, there is no curiosity or interest from the right in what Rice did. Why is that?
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joew



Joined: 18 Jul 1999
Posts: 156

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Walter Cronkite lost us the Viet Nam War? That's a stretch Mike, the scores of books I've read on the subject tell a different story, is this why they call you Mr. Fickshun?
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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
Posts: 3527
Location: on earth

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe the shooting of a camera man and the interviewer were highly probable because of the typical right wing hate that is being condoned by denials by the right wingers... Enabling their lemmings to go murder black and other in churches, shoot gabby, blow up federal buildings, record numbers of threats to the black president even before he stepped into office. Again the right wing energize their base with this right wingers are th victim hate talk.

This right wing we are the victim of the media and in the USA.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/two-tv-journalists-fatally-shot-on-air-in-va/ar-BBm7rTD?ocid=spartanntp

Quote:
Reporter, cameraman shot to death on air in central Virginia


you see any other motive?

again you can read even here the delusional right wingers playing the so called propaganda victim card. Need any other proof for the high probability profile???

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 17466

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nope. That label comes from Mo Gunn and her decades of false personal attacks. I named my source for the Cronkite claim, and have cited references for it in the past.
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jpbassman



Joined: 19 May 1998
Posts: 2869
Location: Leo

PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
Nope. That label comes from Mo Gunn and her decades of false personal attacks. I named my source for the Cronkite claim, and have cited references for it in the past.


and hilarious cartoons..

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