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Pipe dream? Obamacare
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5834

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find it interesting that folks say that "we will be adding millions of people into a system that does not have enough doctors, equipment, medicine, etc, to support what we have now", especially since the number of people requiring medical care is essentially the same. However, as I pointed out earlier, it's likely that there will be a transition with doctors and medical staff moving from emergency services to clinics, managed care facilities and private practices. If there is a shortage moving into the future, there will be a lot of incentive for folks to train and educate themselves for what would be arguably good paying jobs. I have little doubt that the ACA will provide better opportunities overall in the long run.

Rather than dwelling on negative themes so prevalent on the right, wouldn't it be better to look for more positive outcomes?
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overpwr



Joined: 29 Jul 2013
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We can speculate on whatever outcome we want it to happen. Reality is, no one will know until it is fully implemented. Can we agree on that? And for anyone to sit here and say that a government doctor will ever make more money or have more opportunities or incentives created by a government job than privately...well, I find that very "interesting". And if it is true what Mr. Obama says; we will be adding millions of people who at the moment don't have insurance. Isn't this the reason why ACA was created? When people refers to "transitional personnel", what they are really are saying, is that we will be treated by less qualified people. How many American doctors (Qualified, Specialists, Researchers) do you think we can bring into the existing hospitals in cover for the newly added demand? Where would they be coming from? Will the government job pay enough to justify the costs involved with Med school? And this is not about "left" or "right", its about an arrogant men that needs some kind of legacy left behind. A men that spends more time taking vacations, golfing, basketball, entertaining Hollywood stars than International leaders on the last five years than actually working to understand his own plan. If Mr. Obama's plan was so great, he would have passed this long time ago when the Democrats had control of the House and the Senate.
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1952

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I posted a summary of the discretionary spending within the ACA. And yes, it does provide medical school loan forgiveness for under served specialties and populations. It also provides training for triage treatment to nurses and medical assistants so some of the routine care can be taken off the plate of the docs.

The ACA has NO provisions for increasing "government employed doctors". In fact, it really does encourage private practice (albeit group practices instead of solo) by providing incentives that pay for the cost of implementing electronic medical records and billing. My wife and physician friends are almost all receiving these incentives.

And, WTF is wrong with government employed physicians? I know a number of excellent physicians who make great money working in the Indian Health Service.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5834

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just because more folks will be covered by insurance under the ACA doesn't mean that the system will all of a sudden be overloaded. The system has in fact been treating folks that didn't have health insurance in the past, so the numbers of folks needing care is essentially the same.

What's with the "government" doctor and jobs idea? Where are you digging that up? That might exist in the VA, but that has little to do with the ACA or the current healthcare market in the US. Even those covered under Medicare use privately owned medical facilities, doctors and medical staff.

I have to agree with you that there is a lot of speculation going on about the ACA, and that we will have to wait until it is implemented to really understand all the details. For me, I can speculate a lot about Medicare right now, because I'm not in the system yet and lack any real experience with it. That will happen mid next year for me, so I will learn quickly. However, for those of us that have been buying health insurance over time, I seriously doubt that the ACA offers a lot of big surprises.

Regarding whether it's a "left" or "right" thing, I have to disagree. Maybe you haven't been paying attention to the dialog and what the players have been up to. What we do know is that the Democrats in Congress passed a conservative Republican healthcare plan conceived by the Heritage Foundation, and they've had zero support from Republicans, and that has continued since the laws passage in 2010. Because President Obama signed the ACA into law doesn't mean that he conceived and developed the plan. It's quite clear that you don't like President Obama, and that's your choice, but blaming him for everything under the sun just doesn't float. To come off as remotely credible, you're going to need to have more sophisticated arguments with more fact based support to substantiate what you're talking about.
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overpwr



Joined: 29 Jul 2013
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can you deny that under such an important plan, that it will effect millions of people, that this president should at least be more informed about it? And be able to sell it more efficiently? Do you find interesting that he is not going to fully implement ACA until after the 2014 elections? Should anyone be exempt from such great plan? Do you find interesting that while he is telling everyone to tighten the seat belts, he keeps taken vacations every three months? Doesn't none of that bothers you? Replace Obama for Bush, apply the same actions and behavior, still feel the same way? I could care less if this is a Republican or a Democrat President, as long as I am able to keep my business running and people around me feeling secure enough to buy and invest, life is good! Left and Right is just a game that "we" play. It keeps us busy arguing while they laugh. Good night, I hope that all works out if it doesn't, I expect to hear some fantastic apologies from Mr. Chandler cause you know, Mr. Obama would never admit his wrong doing. Oh, and I don't have to apologize to anybody, for one, I am wrong and two, not sophisticated enough to elaborate a good apology anyhow.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5261

PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know Obama haters when they start saying things like this:

Quote:
Do you find interesting that he is not going to fully implement ACA until after the 2014 elections? Should anyone be exempt from such great plan? Do you find interesting that while he is telling everyone to tighten the seat belts, he keeps taken vacations every three months?


The delays in the roll out of the ACA have primarily resulted from a) Republican efforts to thwart regulations implementing the Act; b) governors in about 2/3 of the Republican state's refusing to cooperate; and c) the fact that most human endeavors, by the right or the left, are more complicated than we initially thought.

Bush took far more vacations than Obama--but then he wasn't black, was he?
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5834

PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Do you find interesting that he is not going to fully implement ACA until after the 2014 elections?"

Actually, I do find it interesting, because the postponement offers the opportunity to change what might be considered a questionable area of the ACA. Should employers be on the hook to provide health insurance? Of course, there's a substantial history of employers providing health insurance as a benefit, particularly in very large corporations, but a lot of small businesses can't necessary afford to provide such benefits. So, the postponement could be a fork in the road. It's either an opportunity to change the ACA, or simply stick with the law and allow more time to educate employers.

What's with the obsession with President Obama's vacations and sports activities? Does it bother me that the president takes some time off? Not at all. Why should it? Do you take time off to do the things that you enjoy?

"Left and Right is just a game that "we" play. It keeps us busy arguing while they laugh."

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. The way that I see it, the politics of the left and right represent very different visions and goals. Although there's a lot theater going on, I feel it's still very serious business overall. I guess we'll find out just how serious over the next few weeks with the budget and the debt ceiling standoffs, because the repercussions could be huge.
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1723
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mac wrote:
You know Obama haters when they start saying things like this:

Quote:
Do you find interesting that he is not going to fully implement ACA until after the 2014 elections? Should anyone be exempt from such great plan? Do you find interesting that while he is telling everyone to tighten the seat belts, he keeps taken vacations every three months?


The delays in the roll out of the ACA have primarily resulted from a) Republican efforts to thwart regulations implementing the Act; b) governors in about 2/3 of the Republican state's refusing to cooperate; and c) the fact that most human endeavors, by the right or the left, are more complicated than we initially thought.

Bush took far more vacations than Obama--but then he wasn't black, was he?

You could use a new gig, with you it's haters, haters this, haters that, haters everything, nothing but haters, if they didn't agree with you, they must be haters.
What are you, a hater?
But then it's your famous icing on the cake, finish it off with your use of the race card again.
What a hater you are of the people who don't agree with you.
Do you have any love in your life?
Just asking.

_________________
I don't drink the 'cool' aid, I drink tequila, it's more honest.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2677

PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

overpwr wrote:
... he keeps taken vacations every three months?

Every three months? That's all?

Hell, Dubya used to take a week off every three days.

Your slam is laughably laughable.


Mr. Turdy wrote:
...haters, haters this, haters that, haters everything, nothing but haters, if they didn't agree with you, they must be haters.
What are you, a hater?.....

Taking lessons from Mikey, Mr. Turdy?

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1485

PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was secure with my Doctors in Dallas since my wife was in hospital administration and we knew how to find and secure the best.

In Dallas, we had two good Doctors move to concierges medicine = just treat a few, but wealthy patients. No walk-ins regardless of insurance.

Now, we moved to Raleigh (wife retired) and we had to start looking for "good" Doctors again. The only way we could get an appointment with some recommended Dr.'s was with written introductions, from friends or Dallas Doctors. Very few will take new patients. Too busy, not enough $ from Medicare or insurance, I don't know? Twice this month, I had nurses say "I don't know how you got in to see Dr. ........", he/she just doesn't take new patients. This new panacea of medical coverage may just be a dream, and a very expensive dream at that.

So, if Doctors are too busy, where will the new added patients from the ACA go? If it's $, will the new ACA insurance policies pay more, less or the same than current policies?

swchandler said:
Quote:
What we do know is that the Democrats in Congress passed a conservative Republican healthcare plan conceived by the Heritage Foundation, and they've had zero support from Republicans, and that has continued since the laws passage in 2010.

Before I would buy into this, I would have to see the specifics of both plans to see how the similarities or differences compare. It's easy to say "apples to apples", but it may just be "apples to oranges".
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