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Pipe dream? Obamacare
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1943

PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

boggsman1 wrote:
Congrats Republicans...ObamaCare funding has been voted down!!!!! But , I think the Tea Party will fund the ACA, they like it better.


Another political stunt. The ACA cannot really be defunded. The bulk of the funding, including the subsidies for insurance, Medicare and Medicaid are mandatory spending...not discretionary spending. Even if the Senate agreed with the House and Obama did not veto, little would really change in the implementation of the ACA.

What could happen is funding for incentives to physicians for implementation of electronic medical records, insurance exchanges, incentives to medical students to practice pediatrics and similar costs could be withheld. The Republicans might piss off a bunch of doctors and state agencies but not really do much else (except gut some of the cost saving measure implementation)

http://www.ncsl.org/documents/health/DisFundingACA.pdf
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3353

PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Co that is a key fact.

Tea Party to do list
Shut down Gov.
Hurt American people esp. Elderly and disabled
Not care.
Mention constitution.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4104

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KC, today the Cleveland clinic announced thousands of layoffs due to Obama care. (yes the same place Obama touted how good the ACA was) If you really look inside your heart, I think you really overstate what the Tea's want. They want what's best for America.

There is a growing movement among the Tea's of focusing on the disproportionate wealth distribution under big govt, and big business. The Tea's are smarter and more patriotic than you think.
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1943

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SB

Isn't this what we want? Over utilization of Medicare services by hospitals has been one of the biggest problems with the current system. I thought conservatives were for cutting costs. Yes, jobs get lost and rearranged. Those of us in the more competitive industries have known this for years.

You guys just cannot be satisfied. Our bloated healthcare industry has not provided results that justify the costs. It has been immune from market forces that might correct that. Shouldn't we address that?
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4104

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The big lie is that jobs would not be lost. Thousands if not hundreds of thousand layoffs are looming. California's un-employment rate just went back up to 8.9%. This is why the Fed continues to print money.

However, I agree that the system should become more efficient. Layoffs in government jobs next? I think not.

Rhetorical question...With virtually every hospital in the US laying off employees, and the system adding more insured patients, how will medical care get better?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14142

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
how will medical care get better?

Easy. 22-yo college grads will now be fully insured against Alzheimer's (at their parents' expense, if desired); we can buy high-coverage insurance at regular prices for stuff that occurred or was diagnosed last year; the public now pays for Sandra's three daily Fluking rubbers; and we can get rich buying stock in companies that manufacture doctors' waiting room furniture as wait times increase from a few hours (my time to access specialists) to many months (UK times for specialists).

Wait, there's more ... 10,000 pages and counting ... more ahead in the regulations already oozing out of Obamacare's pores.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5808

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Rhetorical question...With virtually every hospital in the US laying off employees, and the system adding more insured patients, how will medical care get better?"


Bard, aren't you a little short on the details? For instance, why is this Cleveland clinic going to lay-off thousands of staff? You attribute it to the ACA, but what kind of staff and the specifics why are nowhere to be seen. The thing to remember is that folks will continue to need healthcare, and the implementation of the ACA will not change that in any appreciable way. Over time, it can be anticipated that emergency room services will fall off for certain types of care, since insurance will ultimately channel these requirements toward a different segment of the industry, such as neighborhood clinics or managed care facilities designed for preventative medicine and diagnostic care. Much of this exists today for folks that do have insurance, so I would anticipate that these areas of medical care would have the opportunity to grow to meet an expanding need. What I would anticipate is a bit of reshuffling over time between the different types of facilities delivering care.

You talk a lot about small and medium type of businesses and the need to promote and growth them, but you conveniently ignore how the ACA might actually do just what you want. These would be good higher paying jobs that folks will undoubtedly train and strive for. Instead of viewing the ACA always in a negative light, you should look for the opportunities it potentially opens up. You need to ween yourself from the naysayers and the predictions of doom and focus on a more positive outlook. Sure, it can be expected that change will have periods of disruption and unsettling events, but this will allow for a stronger more vibrant healthcare industry to grow.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4104

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I appreciate what you said in your last paragraph SWC. However hospitals are letting workers go to save money. Doctors are quitting because of the red tape. These are facts. And, according to the union bosses, and contrary to Obama's words, you will not be able to see your old doctor, unless he is part of the approved group that your new contract calls for. This is because thousands of employers are dropping their old plans to save money. They are putting their employees into new exchanges. Sadly, most people will not be able to see their old doctor.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5808

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't think what you're talking about happens today? With health insurance for years now, with every upcoming year you have the opportunity to completely change your plan. If I elected to go with Health Net instead of United Healthcare this upcoming Fall, everything that I'm doing now, to include the base of doctors I go to, would change. That's a fact, and it wasn't something that came about because of the ACA. It's been that for many years. Regardless of the insurance coverage you choose, you still have the opportunity to make choices outside the plan. If you do so, you might not be covered, or you would have to accept more responsibility for payment. Life's about change and the choices we make. Again, you might want to ween yourself from the propaganda coming from the right and change your view of things. Much of life is about your outlook and attitude.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3353

PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That simply did not happen under Romneycare.. More Han 80% of doctors accept it there.
Bard, I think the Teas would like a different outcome from their leaders and are not getting it. They are well intended patriots, even Bachman and the other fools who lead the teas.
Always voting no, and the upcoming shutdown of the Gov. in order to pretend like they are defunding Ocare are examples of bad government being replaced by worst government.
Pretending the reason is the Constitution, after the Supreme Court decided the matter, is the ranting of a group of leaders who have abandoned the constitution whiling waving it in your face.
No matter how well intended and patriotic the pool boy is, I still don't want him to do brain surgery on my country..
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