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Pipe dream? Obamacare
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4650

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I enjoy schadenfreude enough to take great glee in the dawning awareness of at least a few Republicans that demographics are running against them, and the immediate attack of the unhinged. Tom Tancredo, one of the vilest of the reincarnated know nothings, just attacked Rand Paul for supporting an eventual path to citizenship.

Quote:
Former Rep. Tom Tancredo (R-Colo.) regrets his previous endorsement of Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.), disavowing the former ally because he has “flip-flopped” on immigration.

“Rand Paul began his speech in Spanish and it went downhill from there,” Tancredo wrote in an op-ed titled “Why I No Longer Stand with Rand Paul” in the Christian Post. “His speech was filled with virtually every single discredited pro-amnesty cliché you could imagine.”

On Tuesday, Paul gave a speech to the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce in Washington calling for comprehensive immigration reform, including allowing undocumented immigrants to remain in the United States, work legally, and eventually become citizens. Paul, however, never used the word “citizenship” or “pathway to citizenship” in his address.

Tancredo said he even regretted the contribution he gave to Paul’s campaign. He actually praised Mitt Romney’s “self-deport” stance, saying there are not just two options available: legalization or deporting all 12 million undocumented immigrants.

“The problem is that not one congressman or major commentator has called for deporting all 12 million illegal immigrants,” Tancredo wrote. “Rather, we argue that strict enforcement of employer sanctions and allowing local police to cooperate in immigration enforcement will encourage most illegal to, in Mitt Romney’s words, ‘self-deport.’”

Tancredo, who has spent most of his career calling for stricter immigration enforcement, goes on to write that Paul is “softer” than President Barack Obama on immigration for his proposal.

“Both Obama and the Gang of 8 say that the illegal immigrants must pay a penalty for legal status, while Rand Paul told reporters after his speech he is not ‘not as a big a stickler’ on these items, because the illegals would not be able to afford the fines,” Tancredo said.

Paul’s speech this week had a welcoming tone and he peppered his address with Spanish phrases as well as calling Hispanic voters “natural” Republicans, something the RNC also said this week in their “autopsy report,” which pledged to open up the party to more Hispanic voters and use more welcoming language. Tancredo doesn’t believe it.

“Rand Paul said that the only reason why the GOP is losing the Hispanic vote is because we have turned them off with ‘harsh rhetoric over immigration,’ Tancredo writes. “Paul doesn’t give a single example of what that ‘harsh rhetoric’ was. Presumably it could have included his pre-flip flop position on immigration.”

Tancredo goes on to call Paul a RINO (Republican in Name Only) and “just another politician” saying he doubts “the grassroots conservatives who elected Rand to Senate and whose support he expects if he runs for president in 2016 feel the same.”

“When I endorsed Rand Paul, I did not expect to agree with him on every issue,” Tancredo wrote. “I respect people with strongly held beliefs regardless of what they are. Most importantly, I felt that I could trust him to maintain his campaign promises. I was wrong. Oh how I long for a Republican leader who exhibits true courage and integrity. That’s the stuff leaders are made of.”

During his time in Congress, Tancredo tried to establish English as the official national language, as well as many other legislative efforts to try and restrict immigration. He left Congress in 2009 after making a failed bid for the GOP presidential nomination in 2008, where he also focused on immigration.



Not every word out of a right wingers mouth, or keyboard, must be overtly racist for the sad history of the party's pandering to bigotry to be clear. Keep it up boys, midterm elections are coming up and every time you rant you lose votes. Sweet.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3021

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see it from the point of view of those workers while they are still in the third world. US corps recruit workers and pay them to come in illegally, esp from Arizona. They send buses for them clear down to Southern Mexico.
It is exactly as Chandler says. If they arrest the employers, as they do in Mexico if they hire Americans, illegal immigration would largely disappear.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5446

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh my, I shutter to think that liberals live amongst us and infect our world.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4650

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can any of you righties name a single high profile prosecution of corporations that systematically hired undocumented workers during the Bush administration? I didn't think so. But you continue to swallow the BS handed out by talk radio. Big hotel chains, and agribusiness, have supported green card programs, and have hired service workers without consideration of their immigration status--in order to keep wages low. Did the hotel corporations fire workers when they found out the social security numbers were bogus? No, they fired them when they tried to organize unions.

You righties can't understand that my distaste for the inherent bigotry in the ranting about "illegals" does not mean that I support, as Techno would have it, an open border. Rather, I see this as part of a bigger game, fundamentally anti-union in origin, with employers given a wink and a nod, and the fools who listen to talk radio brainwashed into thinking it is a Democratic plot. Meanwhile you righties lost nearly all of the votes of citizen immigrants and children of immigrants.
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slinky



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 395
Location: Old Saybrook Ct.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You tell 'em mac!
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1348

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finally, Mac stating that he doesn't want open borders (no one else in this boat?). Nothing will work without closing the borders, which will be very expensive, so what are the liberals suggesting to solve this part of the problem?

I am not opposed to a pathway to citizenship, but what happens to the millions of uneducated "visitors" that will not make enough money to avoid Medicaid, emergency rooms, welfare, free phones, free meals at school, etc. etc.? Will their contributions to society outweigh their drain? I really don't know, but it should be a concern. I guess their newly educated children will take care of them instead of becoming dependent on government?

Much of our economy is tied too closely to the cheap labor that our "visitors" provide, but I don't think that the consumer is reaping that much of a benefit, it's in the profit margin of the companies that hire the "visitors". Politicians don't want to bite the finger of the hand that is feeding them, so we just coast along, doing little or nothing to address the problem.

It must be a tough life for Mac when he is offended by just about everything. PC has drained the life out of free speech in this country, while almost nothing these days can be said that doesn't offend or "disrespect" someone or some group. Whatever happened to "sticks and stones"? Is there no one out there with a backbone anymore?

Nothing posted here in the last couple of years has ever offended me. Why?, because you have the right to say what you want without censorship, which is free speech. Those that do make an effort to belittle or denigrate those that oppose their believes are narrow minded bigots. This goes for parties on both side of the issues. But you do have the right to be a bigot if you choose, just know that your credibility takes a serious hit when you wade into that camp, and that you are not offending me.

And to answer the question about our national debt - Yes, I do believe that increasing taxes is needed to work toward a balanced budget, but not without cutting the waste and or slowing the rate of spending too. We are at a stalemate where neither side trusts the other to do the right thing, so until our nation's credit/borrowing takes a serious hit, we just avoid the issue and keep digging a deeper hole. One day, this country will be dealing with some serious austerity if we don't get our act together.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1348

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And by the way, I don't want Mac to think he has change my mind about illegal immigrants, by using "visitors". When one chooses to break the law, by making an illegal border crossing, what they do is "illegal". There is no way to twist this fact into any other meaning or words. If anyone is offended by this, so be it. Driving without a driver's license is also illegal, but I doubt this can be twisted into an offensive statement if one is called an illegal driver. Maybe the left can, give it a shot.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3328
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Technoo. Let me ask again...how do we "close the border"?
Secondly as I stated before, the economic benefits of the migrant worker are huge, especially in a global AG/commodity world. 50% of AG workers in this country are undocumented...can you imagine the hurt you would put on this country if you were able to force a change . From my perch in the financial world, I can tell you that inexpensive labor, and profit margins do have a huge impact on the "consumer".
I would agree that a culture of uneducated manual labor has to change. Thats why a path to citizenship is critical. UNLESS you and your Republican colleagues can lobby the Chamber of Commerce successfully, and tell them they are no longer allowed to employ the undocumented....I'll hold my breath.
BTW Technoo, labeling another human being "illegal" is demeaning, I think its important to be conscientious to our fellow human beings, regardless of their origins.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 3609

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boggs, because of unfettered migration, wages are falling in the developed countries. As a matter of fact, guys like me can find workers for half the price as we did when Bush was prez. I should like this, but I don't. It is harming the American citizens. Gold is collapsing in this Alice in Wonderland economy. Wages are falling. Corporations and govt are reaping all the benefits.

My Hispanic wife and family were all LEGAL immigrants to this country. They do not think the term "illegal immigrant" is incorrect or devisive.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3328
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve...thanks for proving my point. I will add that I think we need a policy in this Country, Im not advocating for open borders, but unlike Repubs, I think we need to deal with the situation that we currently have. Which is 50% of the AG workers in this country are un-documented. What should we do?
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