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Pipe dream? Obamacare
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1493

PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler said:
Quote:
my bet is that the ACA, or its newer improved version, will succeed over time.


Finally, an opinion of where the ACA is going. Thanks. However, I am not sure what "its newer improved version" means. I guess you are saying that as it is now, it will tank and will have to be revised in some way to be a success. At least you are willing to be honest about where may be headed.

When I speak of government not being able to manage a program like the ACA, I am speaking about a liberal government under the leadership of a man that wants massive government control without the support of half the country. Just the selection of the Canadian software company to do the web site is a clue to the ineptitude of this administration. One day, the web site will be working just fine after tossing several million more dollars at the problem. Then what? We shall see.

The conservatives want better health care too, but one giant package is not the answer, in my opinion.

As I have said many times, I would have been fine and could have done better without SS or Medicare. They do work, but they will have to be bailed out or modified if they are to keep working.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5893

PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess that you failed to read the last paragraph of my earlier post. Republicans have had many opportunities to improve or change the ACA, particularly since January 2011, yet it's no surprise to anyone that they don't seem inclined at all to accept any part of the ACA. In fact, prior to the passage of the ACA, congressional Republicans do not have a record of legislating for any kind of serious healthcare reform. All their efforts to delay, thwart and shrink healthcare reform were simply legislative maneuvers to kill it. Again, coming up to the 2014 elections, Republicans will predictably run against the healthcare law with everything they've got. The idea that Republicans want healthcare reform is a patent lie.

You really don't want to admit that Social Security and Medicare have been well run government programs. Given time to work through early difficulties with the roll-out of the ACA, there will be further evidence that the government can handle the job very well. While Republicans don't want to take any responsibility for the myriad of roadblocks or problems they have actively caused, I remember what happened. If you were honest about things, you would too.

While you're so confident that you could have done better without SS and Medicare, you have to remember that the majority of folks don't. That's a fact. What's exceedingly clear to me is that you have little or no appreciation of anything done for the public good. You're just one of those self centered people that want to pick and choose what they want in society and readily disregard everything they don't. Next time you're windsurfing at public beach, just remember those that fought for access in the public good. Next time you pass a public school or university, just remember the folks like me that paid for it even though we may not have had any children.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2706

PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

reinerehlers wrote:
No, John Kerry.

That can't be so. Kerry has a job, and he's doing it.
.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14322

PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When an issue is too complex and/or ill-defined for valid detailed analysis, or for a reality check on that analysis, I step back and look at big picture ... the forest. In this case, we have two forests to evaluate.

The first is the ACA and the many thousands of pages of new laws derived from it. They mandate that the health care and insurance industries treat tens of millions more people with FAR fewer doctors for MUCH less money, and expect young healthy people with reduced job opportunities to line up by the tens of millions to fund it.

Asinine.

The second is Obama's and the DNC's openly declared end game of Obamacare: single-payer government managed health care, aka socialized medicine. The UK, Canada, and many other nations have proved it provides truly crappy health care and is STILL going bankrupt.

Who on earth thinks our federal government, which can't do ANYTHING right, can manage our very lives for us?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14322

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
At http://tinyurl.com/p8qtdrk ,
Michael Boskin, Stanford University economics professor, senior fellow at the Hoover Institution, and ex-chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers, says

"sticker shock" ... has only begun.

the insurance market will unravel in a "death spiral" of ever-higher premiums and fewer signups if, as many predict, too few healthy young people sign up for insurance that is overpriced in order to subsidize older, sicker people.

The Kaiser Foundation study of Ocare disagrees, in part. They say the youth, per se, aren't as big a threat as Boskin believes. They say the youth alone may not trigger a premium spiral, that only if healthy people of all ages opt out of Ocare in large numbers and pay the light fine will it drive up premiums significantly.

But then, why would anyone, of any age, not needing immediate expensive health care buy Ocare rather than just pay the fine and sign up only after getting their cancer diagnosis or getting hit by a bus? We could just put a policy in our exchange shopping cart and leave instructions with a lawyer, family members, etc. to pay the premium while we're en route to the hospital. What else makes sense for big health expenses?

"Civic duty", you say? BS. If every bleeding heart who uses that excuse voluntarily donated money to the federal government or their insurance companies, we we wouldn't need fat taxes or insurance fees, and the IRS could get out of the business of deciding whether a 70-yo windsurfer or skier deserves two working knees or chemo.
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youwindsurf



Joined: 18 Aug 2012
Posts: 671
Location: Classified

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
Who on earth thinks our federal government, which can't do ANYTHING right, can manage our very lives for us?


I rather enjoy driving on our Nation's highway system.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3459

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Read Isos post
It contains no vulgar insults, doesnt tell the libs their opinions, or brag about his infallible opinion backed up by thousands of experts.
He didnt lie about not being able to see 58 other posters while calling them liars for things he read in their posts.

I thought he had changed but remembered the new moderators and noticed his advice to rip off the healthcare system and put the cost on the American public.
It never crossed his mind that some folks are honest so we wont follow his lead on this.
Rock on.
Too bad he swears he cant read this.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2706

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

keycocker wrote:
Read Isos post
It contains no vulgar insults, doesnt tell the libs their opinions, or brag about his infallible opinion backed up by thousands of experts.
He didnt lie about not being able to see 58 other posters while calling them liars for things he read in their posts.

I thought he had changed but remembered the new moderators and noticed his advice to rip off the healthcare system and put the cost on the American public.
It never crossed his mind that some folks are honest so we wont follow his lead on this.
Rock on.
Too bad he swears he cant read this.

And, if you notice, he quotes an absolute expert.

Himself.

Good thing he's not on his killfile list, or he wouldn't be able to read what he wrote.
.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5893

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Who on earth thinks our federal government, which can't do ANYTHING right, can manage our very lives for us?"


I would love to see our federal government cut him off entirely. That would include his pension, medical coverage, disability payments, commissary privileges and any other federal benefits he now receives. I would love to hear him squeal after that. Some folks need to lose everything they've got to begin to appreciate what they once had.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3459

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL
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