myiW Current Conditions and Forecasts Community Forums Windsurfing Videos Buy and Sell Services
 
Hi guest · myAccount · Log in
 SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RegisterRegister 
luff vs boom length
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Windsurfing Discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3061
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zirtaeb wrote:
Theory, long booms are better for light air.
Preference...U2 prefers shorter boom, taller luff.
Me, preference, whatever works the better.
We know the newest NP's and Hansen's have super long booms for their biggest


Nice.

but why have such longer booms, when the sail is freekin huge anyway,

and will they plane any sooner than a moderate length boom ? Perhaps their are other design considerations they are following , overpowered being one, that may work better

beyond 205cm boom length my arms can't get the clew end out of the water so easy

_________________
K4 fins
4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2396

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most Formula uphaul their 10 and + sails, the 9's depending on where the sail falls.
If you're talking dragging the clew while sailing, RAISE the sail with more extension. Don't need to close the gap between tack and base cleat if the sail drags. Also, move the base farther back to raise the foot of the sail when planing. I know you know this.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3061
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

no I mean waterstarting, and their is some consideration when doing a step jibe with a longer boom,
I guess it just takes longer to maneuver .

my physical dimensions are not so large, about as tall as a garden gnome

8.5m is the largest I have EVER sailed, and have no urge whatsoever to go any bigger.

_________________
K4 fins
4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2396

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suspect most windsurfers uphaul anything 8 meters or bigger, since you're riding a bigger board then, and the water is usually flatter.
I see the Crissy Formula guys waterstarting and duckjibing their 10's, but they're young big strong guys, not like us old farts.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14238

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 4:10 pm    Post subject: Re: luff vs boom length Reply with quote

DelmarEdward wrote:
All other things being equal, and in lower wind conditions, would you want a longer luff and shorter boom, or shorter luff and longer boom length in a sail for early planing?

In case U2's posts in this thread leave your head reeling, too, Delmar, the definitive, otherwise unanimous (including Ezzy) answer to your specific question above, within the confines of its opening phrase, is "the latter". This presumes, of course, that the sail was designed by somebody we've heard of, not just some tentmaker. Throw out the opening five words, as many here including yourself have done, and the question and answer(s) changes completely.

The same goes for fin and board aspect ratios, all within reason. However, there's no free lunch; virtually every tweak (by a reputable designer) has both a gain and a loss in other performance parameters. Tip: it's a lot cheaper, and very effective, to change fins before buying new boards or sails.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DelmarEdward



Joined: 05 Aug 2012
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if i can change tacks so to speak i'd like to ask a question about waterstarting these large sails.

so you all know where i'm coming from, i've never even tried to truly waterstart any sail, i use a large board all the time and usually have not been out in strong winds. the couple of times i've tried in strong winds and a small sail it has ended in nose crunching failure.

i do "deep" beach starts in water up to my neck though, even with the 9.9, but at least one foot can touch the bottom, otherwise i uphaul.

do you mean someone can waterstart a large cammed sail with the luff full of water? i can't imagine doing that unless i was wearing flippers!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3061
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the larger the sail, cause their is more of it in water, the harder it is to waterstart, once in a flying position , it doesn't make much difference on size, cams just may make it harder to position.

small board and big enough sail, go play

_________________
K4 fins
4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5834

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll take one more stab at it, but I'll still hold to my earlier comments. I have a number of sails spanning a time range from 2001 to 2007, and the differences between them is luff length and boom size. I have a 2001 Windwing Catalyst Wave 5.0, and a 2007 Hansen Wave 5.1, with the former having a longer boom length and the latter having a longer luff. I also have a 2007 Hansen Wave 5.6 that has the same boom size as the 2001 Catalyst 5.0. Going further, I have a 2003 Windwing Catalyst Wave 5.75 and a 2004 Windwing Hammer 6.3 (I using it as an RAF with all cambers removed), with the former having a longer boom length and the latter having longer luff.

First, I have to admit that most of my sails tend to be quite old, nevertheless, they are all designed by Bill Hansen, so one could say that they all include things Bill has learned and used. Now, which ones do I like the most? I must admit that the longer boom 5.0 and 5.75 often come out ahead, but I can benefit by going to the 5.6 on a smaller board with the same size boom and getting a bit more out of the longer luff. I can say the same about the 5.75 versus the 6.3, but the 6.3 only wins out if winds are quite light. Even though the 6.3 has a shorter boom, it doesn't handle as near as well as the 5.75, and I have to say that the longer boom on the 5.75 gives it the power of a 6.0.

Now, coming back to my original post, I rig all of these sails with a flatter foil, so I hold true to my feelings about the shape of the foil. That's my personal preference, so I wouldn't go on to say that's for everyone, particularly for bigger and heavier sailors.

Lastly, we'll live with what the sail designers make for us over time. Fortunately, different designers have their own ideas, even following current design paths. That's one reason why one brand may catch your attention and another doesn't. In a limited interest sport like windsurfing, that's all to our benefit, since we still have many options.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2396

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suspect most of us can waterstart sails up to around 8 meters, and from there on up, it depends how the sail falls, how much time we have, and how cold the waters are for our wetsuit preparations.
Naturally, riding a sinker board with a 6.5, it's waterstart only. For me, that combo is a 75 liter board with a 6.5 or 7 meter sail. I doubt any of us can uphaul true sinkers. I HAVE seen CraigYester, at 185 lbs., uphaul his 8'2" poly glass boards of what appears to be less than 80 liters. His trunks were fully underwater.
As for max sails waterstarting, it depends on your board, the water conditions, and your skill level.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 700

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've learned waterstarting on an 8M, there is so much less energy expended compared to uphauling. But I have a longboard and can rest the boom on the tail which really helps a lot, I don't think you can do that on any modern shortboards especially when the boom is all the way at the top of the cut out in my case.
I'm currently considering a 10M no cam sail and if I buy it I will get one of those foam pads that straps to the clew to float it, also an impact vest to help float my body.
Uphauling an 10 or 12M sail seems like it would be very strenuous.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Windsurfing Discussion All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Page 6 of 7

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum

myiW | Weather | Community | Membership | Support | Log in
like us on facebook
© Copyright 1999-2007 WeatherFlow, Inc Contact Us Ad Marketplace

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group