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A rude ending to the Armstrong myth
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13273

PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's bad enough to be a cheater. That's absolutely disgusting at any level, because it deprives honest competitors, the only ones worthy of respect in any endeavor I can think of, of their deserved rewards. Cheating at THIS level, to THIS extent, for THIS long, to the extent that it sets a putrid example to maybe a billion people, should be criminally prosecuted. Doping, falsifying resumes, shoplifting, academic cheating, concealing preexisting medical problems on insurance applications, lying under oath, marital infidelity, tax cheating, sports rules violations ... it's all the same in that it betrays obligations, oaths, and onuses we willingly accepted to level the playing fields and harms others in the process.

As appointed state chairman of Utah's 3,000 dirt bike racers in ~70 annual races, one of my duties was sole adjudicator of all claims of cheating. Sheltering honest racers from losing to cheaters was well worth losing some so-called "friends" due to my impartial and expert (I was on the committee that wrote the rules) adjudication of rules violations. I have no sympathy for Armstrong besides, "What a waste of phenomenal talent and drive."
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5437

PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The following commentary appeared today in the Washington Post. I present it because it provided a different view on the idea and legality of performance enhancement drugs and activities. I must emphasize that the views presented by the author do not represent my views, as I like to remain neutral in this matter.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/lance-armstrongs-fall-a-case-for-allowing-performance-enhancement/2012/10/26/6f7cccf0-1d41-11e2-b647-bb1668e64058_story.html?hpid=z3
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1247

PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Precisely Iso. NO, a million times NO to allowing doping to become the norm in sport. WRONG!!!

Cyclings governing body (UCI) is increasingly coming under pressure to explain their apparent complicity in the wholesale doping culture which has taken such a hold in pro cycling under the governance of Verbruggen and McQuaid. They have a case to answer!

The UCI management meeting, after a barrage of criticism, has now voted to set up an independent investigation into how such a state of affairs was allowed to flourish? It must NOT be allowed to become an internal whitewash!

Nothing but a wholesale clearout (dopers, doping team doctors, doping team managers) which some teams have already started (Sky is sacking several with past doping connections ) MUST take place if pro cycling is to regain any credibility. It's absolutely sickening to hear those well known riders who themselves have served bans for doping, speaking out in defence of Armstrong, and the pro omerta. The culture has become so endemic that they actually don't believe they are doing anything wrong! No wonder we get idiots suggesting that cjhemical enhancement of performance should be allowed!

Many famous sports people are now speaking out against doping. (Not academics, but SPORTS competitors.) Nigel Mansell (ex F 1 world champion) runs a youth cycling team, bringing them up to pro standard. He has a zero drugs policy in force. Do so, and you're OUT. As he says, what kind of role model and example is Armstrong to the young!

This scandal has given cycling an opportunity to clean up. It will be criminal, and a betrayal of the young asapiring riders if they do not do so!
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1385

PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:
Precisely Iso. NO, a million times NO to allowing doping to become the norm in sport. WRONG!!!

Cyclings governing body (UCI) is increasingly coming under pressure to explain their apparent complicity in the wholesale doping culture which has taken such a hold in pro cycling under the governance of Verbruggen and McQuaid. They have a case to answer!

The UCI management meeting, after a barrage of criticism, has now voted to set up an independent investigation into how such a state of affairs was allowed to flourish? It must NOT be allowed to become an internal whitewash!

Nothing but a wholesale clearout (dopers, doping team doctors, doping team managers) which some teams have already started (Sky is sacking several with past doping connections ) MUST take place if pro cycling is to regain any credibility. It's absolutely sickening to hear those well known riders who themselves have served bans for doping, speaking out in defence of Armstrong, and the pro omerta. The culture has become so endemic that they actually don't believe they are doing anything wrong! No wonder we get idiots suggesting that cjhemical enhancement of performance should be allowed!

Many famous sports people are now speaking out against doping. (Not academics, but SPORTS competitors.) Nigel Mansell (ex F 1 world champion) runs a youth cycling team, bringing them up to pro standard. He has a zero drugs policy in force. Do so, and you're OUT. As he says, what kind of role model and example is Armstrong to the young!

This scandal has given cycling an opportunity to clean up. It will be criminal, and a betrayal of the young asapiring riders if they do not do so!


I really don't know much about cycling, but the fact is that athletic performance is becoming more and more "engineered", be it with scientific nutrition regimes that may not do harm, or training methods that actually wreck the bodies of pre-pubescent gymnasts (e.g.).

I think the sport (and sports in general, at least in the US) needs a focus shift from word records, the gold medal winners etc. to a different narrative - one that encourages participation instead of hero worship from the couch.

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speedysailor



Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Posts: 841

PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of all places to confess, the Oprah show. Say it aint so . . .
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1247

PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Strategy - pure and simple Speedy! (Thrashed out with his very expensive lawyers.)

He is in big trouble!

Quote, 'Lance Armstrong is in talks to return a portion of the millions of dollars in taxpayer money his former team U.S.Postal Service once received'. (Various figures are being bandied about, some as much as 100 million dollars -triple the amount paid out.)

Quote, 'Senior Justice Department officials have recommended that the government join a law suit filed by one of Armstrongs team mates (Landis) that accuses the disgraced cyclist of defrauding the Federal Government. Armstrongs U.S.Postal sponsorship PROHIBITED illegal doping.' (Weisel and several of Armstrongs millionaire business associates -Tailwind- are implicated in the deception.)

Should Armstrong 'go down' it is inevitable that he will 'throw everyone else under the bus.' Pat and Hein the U.C.I. heads who were accused of complicity in his 'mafia' ring will clearly be among them!

P.S. It seems clear that Travis (U.S.A.D.A.) was playing the long game with regard to implicating the U.C.I. heads, and may be relying on Armstrong to bring their corruption to an end.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1247

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

P.P.S.

C.B.S. News sources claim; 'Lance Armstrong has offered to pay more than 5 million dollars to the Federal Government to compensate for the fraud he allegedly commited against the U.S.Postal Service, and that he also offered to be a cooperating witness in a Federal investigation.

Their sources say that the Department of Justice turned down both offers as inadequate!

Explanation enough of his calculated about turn, and public confession!!!
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4649

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GT--there is an interesting irony in this. The high money stakes that have corrupted sports--baseball and football as well bicycling--appear to be the motivation for Armstrong to act now. He is under real pressure on fraud charges--which have a lower standard of proof.

Randy Newman said it best--it's money that matters. Follow it and see where it leads.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1247

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Absolutely Mac!

I'm glad that you at least, see the truth. (Thanks.)
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5437

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With this recent turn of events in Armstrong's position on use of performance enhancing drugs, the thing that really has come starkly apparent to me in all the news is his ruthless treatment of others over the years. Seems like his karma is catching up with him. One wonders if he is slippery enough to weasel out of his predicament smelling like a rose.
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