myiW Current Conditions and Forecasts Community Forums Buy and Sell Services
 
Hi guest · myAccount · Log in
 SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RegisterRegister 
Big Oil and citizenship
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 18, 19, 20 ... 40, 41, 42  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Politics, Off-Topic, Opinions
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2899

PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So you were lying then?..........again.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5581

PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm, the point that I have made here, which you are avoiding, is that Chevron ignored their own safety standards and the refinery caught on fire. Hundreds of people went to the hospital. Not the first significant release from this refinery. This was during the period of time that they were trying to expand that refinery--but were not clear about whether it would allow them to use even higher, more corrosion causing crude. That was the lawsuit that they lost. They then went to the legislature and trying to get a bill that gave them a pass on CEQA. Massive fire due to corrosion--the issue in court and the political issue, big fines, criminal convictions--and you describe the people who are suing them as bank robbers. You say that is not dismissal? In your world Chevron's not being able to expand their refinery has nothing to do with their incompetence, or health issues, but only to unreasonable opposition by your arch enemy environmentalists. They seem to be pretty effective--especially when big oil is so bumbling and dishonest.

You have never taken responsibility for either misinterpreting someone's post or not being clear. Your response--so mature for someone who considers himself so accomplished--is to call people who call you on your spin liars. What a pathetic piece of work.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2899

PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems timely to remind everyone of this.........

mrgybe wrote:
It's called the Bruiser Bounce..........

Step 1. Post a silly, or fabricated, or wildly inaccurate accusation
Step 2. Be proven wrong, or made to look foolish
Step 3. Bounce to a totally unrelated silly, fabricated or wildly inaccurate accusation and repeat

Intersperse steps 1 & 3 liberally with name calling, personal slurs and defamatory comments.


Here it is again in all it's squalor. Once more Bruiser is caught in a blatant fabrication. And again he lashes out. Never learns. Perhaps some professional help is needed here.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5581

PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny, that's exactly what you did--on the whacky Catholic network attacking Melinda Gates, on the "Obama phone" story, on the environmentalists--and me opposed to malaria control. Post an outrageous story that had already been debunked, attack, spin. What a guy. Maybe professional help is impossible. Apparently life inside the bubble can't be affected by facts.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1550

PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we need Judge Judy here to get to the facts without superfluous, wordy responses. "Just answer the question with a yes or a no".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5581

PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last night, while at the wedding of a close friend's daughter, I had occasion to eat dinner with one of the people that went to the hospital in the wake of the Chevron refinery fire in Richmond. She described the harrowing experience, and the lack of information. Of course, Chevron had resisted installing air pollution monitors that community activists had lobbied for, so there was no information available, in either real time, or after the fact, about the levels of contamination that people were exposed to.

When the City of Richmond sued Chevron, mrgybe described those affected by the plume as bank robbers ("Willie Sutton"). Trained in excellent and empathetic communication skills inside the oil business, when I described his comments as "dismissive", he retorted:

Quote:
So you were lying then


So I thought this op ed piece particularly evocative of both the mistrust in the community, and the wrong-headed approach of Chevron to their critics:

Quote:
Time for a serious discussion with Chevron

By Dr. Jeffrey Ritterman, guest commentary 2013 Bay Area News Group
Posted: 08/17/2013 12:01:00 PM PDT

Recently I, along with thousands of others, marched from the Richmond BART station to the Chevron Refinery to protest Chevron's utter disregard for the future of our dear Earth and all of life.

The math is terrifyingly simple. If we humans burn 20 percent of the known fossil fuel reserves, we have an 80 percent chance of staying within the 2 degree Celsius red line we dare not cross.

At 2 degrees, we lose half of the Sierra snowpack and, therefore, half of our drinking water. I'll really miss my half. How about you?

Yet, Chevron keeps exploring every last inch of the earth for more fossil fuels. So, here's our message to Chevron: You can stop exploring. You can invest all of that money in renewable energy and become a renewable energy company. Otherwise, it is our duty to all that lives to make sure that you cease to exist.

And while you are making the transition, since you can only burn 20 percent of your known reserves, give us the cleanest 20 percent, not that nasty stuff with high sulfur that caused the last two fires.

You have demonstrated twice that you can't safely handle the high-sulfur crude. You haven't fixed the pipes. Don't give us the risky stuff.

And for those of us who live in Richmond, it is time for us to engage in a serious discussion.

How will we replace Chevron's $40 million in tax revenue if the company fails to read the writing on the wall. Chevron does seem to suffer from mural dyslexia, or is it moral dyslexia? Time will tell.
It's time for all of us, from the Richmond Progressive Alliance to the Chamber of Commerce and everyone in between, to begin strategizing on how to make Richmond sustainable by 2050.

If Chevron will join us and partner by becoming a renewable energy company, all the better. If not, we need to make other plans and we should start now.

Dr. Jeffrey Ritterman is a former member of the Richmond City Council and a resident of Richmond


I need not agree with everything that Ritterman has said to conclude that the corporation has poisoned its relationship with Richmond with its management style--so evident in the dismissive comments by unflinching supporters of the carbon industry on this forum.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rigitrite



Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 324
Location: Kansas City

PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The math is terrifyingly simple. If we humans burn 20 percent of the known fossil fuel reserves, we have an 80 percent chance of staying within the 2 degree Celsius red line we dare not cross.


This statement has always been my issue with global climate change. I think you'd have to be pretty faded to believe that humans aren't adding a significant amount of CO2 and particulate to the atmosphere, and that in turn is almost certainly making things warmer. However....to make the leap to GLOBAL CATASTROPHY from these facts is false. The earth has complex controls via numerous ecosystems and complex interactions between geology, atmospheric gasses, temperature strata, etc.... Alarmists are suposing that if we go over this 2 C "line" that climate will spin out of control. Not only is this an extremely unsophisticated conclusion to reach, but it's the exact same kind of silly alarmism that conservatards use ad nauseum. I don't buy it.

Oh, BTW, even the most ardent liberal tree hugger is gonna burn every....single.....drop.....of oil if the alternative means walking to work, no electricity, or not getting to fly to Hawaii for vacation. We're not going back to 18th century technology....were just not. This is not political, it's just human nature.

_________________
Kansas City
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5581

PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rigitrite. Nor do I buy it, not entirely. But the trust issue, and the dismissive attitude of the oil folks is what my point is about.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
rigitrite



Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 324
Location: Kansas City

PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the attitude of the oil industry (in which I work), can best be summed up the the axiom: "money changes people".

So, you can imagine what people are willing to do and say when dollar signs turn their eyes into sorcerous pin-wheels. There's just SOOOOOOOOOO much money to be made in energy, espcially oil & gas; it leads to the kind of mindset where people eventually start thinking that decapitation is a good solution for dandruff*




*Frank Zappa

_________________
Kansas City
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14635

PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rigitrite wrote:
you'd have to be pretty faded to believe that humans aren't adding a significant amount of CO2 ... to the atmosphere, and that in turn is almost certainly making things warmer.

You're ignoring the CO2 effect's plateau.


Last edited by isobars on Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Politics, Off-Topic, Opinions All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 18, 19, 20 ... 40, 41, 42  Next
Page 19 of 42

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

myiW | Weather | Community | Membership | Support | Log in
like us on facebook
© Copyright 1999-2007 WeatherFlow, Inc Contact Us Ad Marketplace

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group