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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1398

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrgybe wrote:
You may wish to look a little more closely at the data you have provided. Jimmy Carter was President from Jan 1977 to Jan 1981.


you're absolutely right - I was distracted by the unemployment column...

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florian - ny22

http://www.windsurfing.kasail.com/
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14624

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrgybe wrote:
he did put the perpetrators in jail, and signed Sarbanes Oxley into law.

Bush also warned, repeatedly, with increasing levels of alarm and emphasis, to stop the madness. He pressed the Congress very hard to deliver a bill reining in Wall Street, the mortgage madness, etc. They refused.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2766

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
mrgybe wrote:
he did put the perpetrators in jail, and signed Sarbanes Oxley into law.

Bush also warned, repeatedly, with increasing levels of alarm and emphasis, to stop the madness. He pressed the Congress very hard to deliver a bill reining in Wall Street, the mortgage madness, etc. They refused.

So, when problems occurred in the Bush years, it was Congress at fault.

But when problems caused by the GOP-controlled Congress occur in the Obama years, it's Obama at fault.

It's clear that you think Bush could do no wrong and Obama can do no right.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3753
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
boggsman1,

So Obama isn't talking about tariffs on Chinese solar panels? He's already done it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/21/business/energy-environment/us-to-place-tariffs-on-chinese-solar-panels.html?hp
\
2.9-4% is the normal course of business, 45% is meant to halt all importing, and it did. Mr Gybe , you can follow the CPI, but inflation in housing and raw materials, and crude was massive from 2003- 2008 when crude crested near 150/barrel. You're missing my point, again. Obama will not press Apple or tech, anymore than Bush would press the oil patch. BTW- many wall streeters made billions off the Enron scam, Jim Chanos is one...and Howard Shilit warned people of Enron for years. I dont think you want to include the auditors in the group that was duped...they were complicit!


Last edited by boggsman1 on Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3753
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
mrgybe wrote:
he did put the perpetrators in jail, and signed Sarbanes Oxley into law.

Bush also warned, repeatedly, with increasing levels of alarm and emphasis, to stop the madness. He pressed the Congress very hard to deliver a bill reining in Wall Street, the mortgage madness, etc. They refused.

This commentary is so wrong, its not even funny. Bush appointed chris cox at the SEC, who immediately moved to remove the uptick rule...a huge barrier to short sellers. He also removed the bear stearns rule which restrained IB's to 8-1 balance sheet leverage...IB's went to 33-1 from 8-1, I think most remember how that ended. He also did NOTHINg when non-bank lenders started to dominate originations nationwide, and invented loans like the pick-a-payment loan that Golden West invented. The only thing he wanted was a reduction in size of Fannie/freddie, but that is also suspect. The Mortgage Bankers Association would not let that happen, there is too much money for the Banksters through the largess of Fan-Fred.
So, to say that Bush tried to stop the madness would be like saying Robby Naish isnt very good at windsurfing.
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mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2895

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Credit me with a little intelligence. Of course I know of the financial support the President receives from tech..........and I am well aware that he will pander to the groups that support him. That's my point..........he cannot, and will not deliver the "hope and change" that caused so many to vote for him. He is just another flawed politician. I never doubted that.......but many will be greatly disappointed. We'll see how that translates at the polls.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3753
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr G...you're an interesting fellow....but predictable. When you breached the subject of Apple's use of Chinese manufacturing, a very complex debate subject, I thought an interesting thread might ensue. But, dopey me, rather than discuss the subject...and Walmart, and all other tech companies use of cheap chinese labor to satisfy our insatiable desire for material goods...you decided to use it as an opportunity to bash Obama. tsk tsk, not productive or original.
If you want to shed light on the subject, offer your opinion, unleash your brilliance on the topic, we would love to hear it. If you just want to poke at Obama, save it for someone who cares.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 6031

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"...and I am well aware that he will pander to the groups that support him."


Let me ask you this mrgybe, are any of the four Republican candidates running for president any different? Whether you like it or not, it's the stock and trade of politics.

You know, one has to wonder. If President Obama and his administration pandered more to big oil interests, would mrgybe's view of Obama be different.
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mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2895

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you really want to pursue the subject of Apple's behavior in it's Chinese sweat shops? OK.........

"Workers also [in addition to outrageous forced working hours] face life-threatening and hazardous conditions. In 2011 four workers were killed and 77 injured in plant explosions from combustible dust. The risk of explosion could have been easily addressed with proper ventilation, according to a U.S. safety expert interviewed by The New York Times. The Times analyzed Apple’s reports for 2008-2010 and found that over a hundred employees were injured by toxic chemical explosions. Other safety violations included improper handling of hazardous materials, inadequate control of air emissions, and a lack of basic safety prevention and emergency preparedness measures. Apple’s own reports demonstrate that the company has known for years that factory conditions don’t meet the company’s own standards.

Why hasn’t Apple, so famously effective at solving engineering problems, been effective at addressing persistent labor and safety violations in assembly factories? As New York Times reporter Charles Duhigg explained to This American Life host Ira Glass, “Apple’s desire to change things within factories runs up against other desires. This desire for quick turnaround, for almost continuous innovation, for delivering products with large profit margins to fund future innovation. Right? So, no matter how strong your desire is to improve working conditions, it comes at a cost to the product at some point.”

http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/2012/03/27/addressing-abuses-at-apple-facilities-in-china/

I have no objection to a company pursuing a lower cost structure outside the US. However, to ignore local labor laws, and to impose working and safety conditions that would be unacceptable in other operations is inexcusable. This is not a recent issue. It has been ignored for years. The richly deserved praise that Apple, and other tech companies receive, need to be tempered by knowledge of the methods they employ to achieve their stellar results. Fixing this should be a top priority.

P.S. All of the Republican candidates are flawed.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5575

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jobs was an asshole, without a doubt, and Apple's behavior, like BP's and many other corporations overseas, borders on criminal. This is why they need to be regulated.
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