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Who is fighting regulation of mercury?
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1354

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you pueno. (I assume you are not on a 'wind up'. You wouldn't do that, would you? Wink )

'Conditioning' was the word I deliberately used to choose, to enrage and counter the progressives who seemed to think I was there to learn from the pupils, rather than the reverse. 'Indoctrination' (another enraging word) is unavoidable in both parenting, and teaching, if we are to pass on and continue the values of civilised society to future generations. It is the EXTENT of indoctrination which is the real issue! (As with work apprenticeships, new recruits must be instructed in how the system works, and what will be expected of them.)

You may be aware that over here, many junior schools (5 year old intake) are increasingly facing major problems. Many children have never so much as opened a book, and some are not even toilet trained. Increasingly, they have NO concept of self control. They want their own way, and want it now!

To compound the problem, sensible sanctions have been removed from teachers. Even a stern telling off can be construed as verbal abuse, with said teacher being 'hung out to dry' by the very authorities who should be backing them. People now just want to cover their own backs, and not stand up and be counted.

The problems are now spreading from urban and inner city areas to the leafy suburbs, and more traditional country areas such as ours. Respect for authority, and behaving unto others...etc is being replaced by f..k society, look after number 1!

I am aware from contact with young teachers just how difficult conditions have become, yet the authorities are in denial, and spread endless statistics to the effect that standards are continually rising. (Year on year rising examination grades... or grade inflation as we insiders call it!) Even employers now indulge in hollow laughter. (Some universities complain that they are forced to run 'remedial' tuition to their new intake, to bring them up to par.)

In short, pueno, effectively applied sanctions, and punishment for those who refuse to display self discipline and accept a commitment to civilised behaviour are necessary. The progressives who have replaced such with with appeals to reason, and efforts to persuade without the concept of punishment, are loosing the battle!
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3387

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crimes in the US have been dropping for most of my life, though many Americans as they age assume crime is rising.
Recently from 2006 to 2010 the murder rate in North America has dropped by a third.
Great Britain murder rate is among the lowest and less than half that of the US.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3387

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am searching for the quote.It was Socrates or one of those guys who said exactly the same thing as GT above post.
I guess this problem has been going on a long time.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1354

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes K.C. Aristotle also had a bad opinion of 'the youth of today'.

But the significant point is that the necessities of far harsher living standards (with no social security cushion to fall back on) were an educator in past times. You either learnt, or perished!

Of course the murder rate here is less than in the U.S. We are fewer people. BUT, the murder rate is now very much higher than say, 50 years ago!

Why?
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4158

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aristotle got is backwards. It isn't the youth that is at fault, it is their parents generation. The same holds true today. I'm privileged to know a few really great kids through coaching and my sons school. What do they have in common? Strong male and female parents who are not afraid to discipline and stick to the consequences. Honestly, keeping them away from the city, malls, troubled kids and broken families is 90% of the battle.

"When we get piled upon one another in large cities, as in Europe, we shall become as corrupt as Europe" Jefferson....

Why do so many reject the wisdom of our founding fathers, the old testament, and the WW2 generation, as if they were writen by fools, and envision a progressive utopia modeled on Marx?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14239

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
Why do so many reject the wisdom of our founding fathers, the old testament, and the WW2 generation, as if they were writen by fools, and envision a progressive utopia modeled on Marx?

Many are recently brainwashed by liberal teachers and haven't yet realized they've been had. Others are just too brain-dead to do the arithmetic of Marxism or socialism. Then, of course, many just live in San Francisco and don't understand how the real world works. Many more don't give a damn about free choice, they just WANNIT, blithely unaware that IWANNIT will collapse; they don't realize that we're not that far behind Greece.

SPEAKING of Greece ... My GOD but I was glad to hear that U.S. taxpayers aren't directly on the hook for rewarding those -ing slackers. If we were, I'd be blasting my congressmen with demands that until everyone of those greedy spoiled bastards gives up EVERY LAST CENT of nanny bucks, Greece must not get one cent.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1485

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And for those that didn't have the guidance from a stable family structure and end up breaking the law, there should be a progressive system that does lock up repeat offenders for life.

Costs? A bunch, but I am willing to pay the needed taxes to support ample jails and prisons. The bad guys have no incentive to be good. More jobs are a side benefit.

In Dallas now, the police will not respond or take a report for shoplifting unless it's for $50 or more. Anything less than $50 in a store is free for the taking with no consequences (well, they might call your mother if they can get your name). On the other hand, Texans are pretty quick to shoot thieves.
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NickB



Joined: 30 Jun 2009
Posts: 498
Location: Alameda, CA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
Costs? A bunch, but I am willing to pay the needed taxes to support ample jails and prisons.


How about paying the needed taxes to ensure that "those that didn't have the guidance from a stable family structure" are less subject to "end up breaking the law"? You know, invest more in assisting them early on through education rather than punishing them later? That would be my choice.

Also, what do people here think of corporal punishment (e.g. caning) as an alternative to prison time (or lack thereof)? I have mixed feelings about this concept, but think that an adequate/humane implementation could potentially be a cheaper and much less harmful deterrent than jail time, at least for first and/or non-violent offenses.
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1952

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno wrote

Quote:
And for those that didn't have the guidance from a stable family structure and end up breaking the law


Now, if that mother would have had access to free contraceptives...just saying.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5260

PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iso--I note that San Francisco is a net contributor to Federal funds, and your red-neck of the woods is a net drain. That sucking sound is hypocrites, taking Federal tax money in excess of what they pay--and supporting Santorum and Newt.
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