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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1385

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both, Isobar's disappearing disability check as well as his USAF pension come out of the public purse. The hypocrisy is not that he cashes his paycheck from the tax paying public. He did, after all, earn it; and so did the people he mentions here - no matter how much more deserving they appear in light of their actual injuries and sacrifices.

No, the US taxpayers were duped into throwing half their income into the defense apparatus under the constant threat of having to learn German or Russian if they didn't (ironically my son speaks both); and as a consequence Iso and very few of his colleagues had the opportunity to pursue short and relatively lucrative careers without really dodging actual bullets. Now, while we're still paying for this bloated apparatus, paying taxes isn't patriotic any longer and instead of adjusting priorities to the new reality, the right portrays any Government effort outside national defense as frivolous (aka: unconstitutional).

The real travesty is that Isobars doesn't really see the blatant Government intervention and distribution of wealth when it comes to his own interests. It's as if he really is blind on one side. Neither his weapons programs nor his missile silos would have been ever possible without radical taxation of US incomes ("at gunpoint", as he likes to say) - especially during the height of the cold war. That he casts himself as a member of a nobler caste, more worthy of the attention and gratitude of the public than others, is just a symptom of his clinical narcissism. I don't expect that condition to go away overnight.

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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2203

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You took the words right out of my mouth.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2344

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
Iso,

Regarding the cell phone thing. In three years since the program started, 10 million folks have the free phones and service. Check out:

http://www.freegovernmentcellphones.net/

I don't know how we managed before cell phones. Life was a struggle in the old days, and even more so when my family was on a party line back in the early 50's.

I hope you can keep in mind that this cell phone program started during the Bush administration and was authorized by the Telecommunication Act of 1996.

It's easy to see that since this cell phone program for needy seniors started 3 years ago, it can be misrepresented as an Obama initiative. But the first subscribers of this program were in mid-2008, before Obama's election.

It's not an Obama program -- and actually has roots going back the the Reagan administration. Moreover, it's funded in part by a small fee charged to current cell phone subscribers.


Last edited by pueno on Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1347

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pueno said:

Quote:
By "government dependence," I assume you mean SS. Don't forget that we pay into that, too. So it's my money or your money.

Quote:
But I'm confused by your logic --- you think I should take government money now so I don't have to take it later? I don't see the difference.


Actually, I was speaking in generalities, meaning that taking unemployment when it actually isn't needed at the time could help people increase their savings to help avoid poverty if after retirement their social security income was small. Or possibly those that are still unemployed well after their unemployment runs out and are heading toward welfare and medicaid.

And since my employers paid into unemployment for 39 years (actually, I am not sure how long unemployment has been around), and I drew upon it twice for a total of less than two years, the government probably came out on the good end of the deal.

And am I really taking government money? In the end, I may wind up taking none or a lot, it's hard to know. However, given my propensity to save and invest, I am sure that I would have done much better with my SS withholding if I had been able to keep it instead of the government. Unemployment, I am sure the government came out ahead in my case. Medicare, we shall see. I am pretty darn healthy and work hard to stay that way, but there are plenty of things that could change all that for which I have no control. The likelihood is that I will have put more money in other people's pockets than in mine via the government programs.

I am not opposed to all government programs as most conservatives would probably agree. I think SS, unemployment and Medicare are good programs, but there may be better options. Clearly, they can't survive on their current track and something has to be done, I am just not sure of the best solution, that's why we elect representatives in government.

I was also in education for most of my life and had several years with the summers off. However, I don't believe any teacher on a 9 month contract (with or without being paid over 12 months) is or would have been eligible for unemployment. It doesn't work that way. When I was on 9 month contracts, I did have the option of being paid for 9 or 12 months (total annual amount was the same).
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2344

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
However, I don't believe any teacher on a 9 month contract (with or without being paid over 12 months) is or would have been eligible for unemployment. It doesn't work that way. When I was on 9 month contracts, I did have the option of being paid for 9 or 12 months (total annual amount was the same).

I'm sorry, but it does work that way -- at least in my state. My teaching colleagues regularly do it.

I chose not to participate because I considered it an unnecessary abuse of a safety net, one that I did not need.

I also had the option of 9-month pay, but then I could not have medical coverage, which goes for and is paid during the full calendar year. So, I chose 12-months of pay and medical on a 9-month contract.

That leaves me technically unemployed for three months; my pay during the summer months is considered "back pay" and so not counted against UI (because it's earned pay that I did not receive during my working months).
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13273

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="techno900" taking unemployment when it actually isn't needed

The likelihood is that I will have put more money in other people's pockets than in mine via the government programs.[/quote]

Refusing to take legitimately earned unemployment benefits is exactly equivalent to donating extra cash with our tax return, which almost no one does.

The overall taxes my wife and I pay exceed my total pension and disability payments.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13273

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler wrote:
given isobars' reputation here for spreading disinformation


Um, hmmm ... a reputation placed into the minds of poor readers by accusations no one has ever been able to back up.

I gave you another chance to be rational. You wasted it.

BubBYE again.
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jpbassking



Joined: 19 May 1998
Posts: 2299
Location: Leo

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
swchandler wrote:
given isobars' reputation here for spreading disinformation


Um, hmmm ... a reputation placed into the minds of poor readers by accusations no one has ever been able to back up.

I gave you another chance to be rational. You wasted it.

BubBYE again.


Ahh geee SW, Mikey gave you another chance to be his pal and you blew it. Shocked

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5436

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"a reputation placed into the minds of poor readers by accusations no one has ever been able to back up."


Frankly, I have been more than fair with you for quite some time now. Your reputation, to include anyone else's here, is predicated on how others judge you, and that is rooted in your conduct and integrity over time. There is no doubt that you spend a lot of time here spreading nonsense that you pick up from highly questionable sources, and often you do it in a particularly hateful way. In my view, you are a willing shill for those sources who specialize in broadcasting blatant disinformation and extreme right wing propaganda. That's what you do, and as a result, your reputation here is based on that fact, whether you want to admit it or not. Really, the only way to change your reputation is to turn things around and prove to others that you're on a more credible path over time. I've advised you many times that you need to change your style, sophisticate your arguments and develop a degree of humility and introspection. That doesn't mean that you need to abandon your conservative ideas and values.

Lastly, you keep up this false illusion that no one has ever been able prove you wrong, or to be at fault for anything at all. Nothing could be further from the truth. You've been caught and cornered so many times it's ridiculous, and everyone knows it. While you can keep denying reality, you can't change the facts.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1889
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No kidding, SWC, I've always enjoyed the repartee with Mike as his drivel keeps me close the the reasons I ran away from an active role in the GOP. To be fare, his vitriolic perspective hit an all time high recently and goaded me into engaging in slap-down responses again. I recall Mike getting so upset and angry in the final, glory days of rec.windsurfing. Indeed, I position Mike as one significant reason rec dot lost the interest of that once international community of windsurfers. My engagement with him may also be another reason and, if so, that's a shame and is for something I take responsibility.

There comes a point where a person must either stop pissing into the wind or realize wet socks. My suspicion is that online exchange largely defines Mike and his sense of self demands that his reputation as he perceives it must be defended at all costs. Without few interpersonal relationships here, Mike fires away without much consideration for the cost of his typing. We've recently read how a person who knows him well and considered him a windsurfing buddy found the online persona of Mike the Runaway Mack Truck. "I cannot be denied!"

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