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Tea with your bigotry?
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5815

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to say that I didn't see mat-ty's posted rock and roll video.

Nevertheless, I have to recognize Dan's great post. Certainly a heartfelt commentary that says a lot. Having watched the 'Civil War' series recently aired on PBS, it's important to remember what happened in that tragic war, to include the long road to today.

Still though, many folks today still have a problem with others that feel differently than they do, and race is only a part of the picture.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5815

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

46 million? Where's that figure coming from?

The point I really wanted to make is that most women that do get pregnant want to have a child. However, there's a minority of women that find themselves pregnant, and don't want a child. I see no reason to deny them the right to terminate their pregnancy. Ultimately, they live with the decision they make, one way or another. Who am I, as a man, positioned to tell a woman what she should do with her life?

You're making a big mistake in casting Planned Parenthood in negative role. Planned Parenthood isn't corrupting women's minds, as you appear to suggest. I think many of us who aren't twisted by narrow religious boundaries understand that very clearly. Planned Parenthood is providing services that many need and want, particularly those in our poorer communities.

Regarding your feelings of being insulted about my comments, you might think about your wealth of comments too, and how insulting they might be to others that don't share your viewpoints.

One thing that you and I share is the fact we won't ever have to think about getting pregnant. Are we in a elevated position to decide for women what they must do when pregnancy unexpectedly happens in their lives?
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1344

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many of us are not religious, and are not narrow minded, but we draw a clear distinction between abortion cases where it is justified, (rape), and women having the right on demand, for life style purposes.

When abortion was introduced over here it was envisaged as a last resort proceedure. Now, it is seen as a right just to get rid of the inconvenient consequences of sex.

Perhaps the inevitable result is that we have created a throw away society (marriage, babies) where many men show little respect for women anymore!
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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 1067

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gurgletrousers
You are absolutely spot on. I do not have a religious bone in my body, I just think it's wrong to take an innocent human life, and abortion is without a doubt, taking a life! And like you said, when it's done for convenience, it only worsens the problem. It's not something I am terribly passionate about , so please spare me all the hate mail, It does not make someone an extremist to feel this way. I am sure there are many libs who feel the same way.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1944
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
Dan it's just a song, take the night off, kick back and relax. Nothing like some good tunes to get your mind off this crazy world we live in.


Matt, you introduced the song into this forum for a reason. What reason might that have been? I'm sure you like other music, but didn't select those songs, did you?

You said the song is "about peoples (sic) misconceptions of people from the south," yet you tell me to "take the night off." Some might call that hypocritical, don't you think?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14157

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
Gurgletrousers
You are absolutely spot on. I do not have a religious bone in my body, I just think it's wrong to take an innocent human life, and abortion is without a doubt, taking a life! And like you said, when it's done for convenience, it only worsens the problem. It's not something I am terribly passionate about , so please spare me all the hate mail, It does not make someone an extremist to feel this way. I am sure there are many libs who feel the same way.


Totally agree. Women have free choice right up the point they choose to have unprotected sex; at that moment they voluntarily give up that right and accept full fiscal, physical, moral, legal, and societal responsibility for the consequences. It's just like rolling the dice at the craps table or taking out a mortgage; no way in hell does the taxpayer have ANY responsibility for the consequences of her free choice. I couldn't care less if an adult woman or a juvenile with parental consent) has one early term abortion on my nickel, but late term or frequent abortion is a whole 'nuther ball game. What the far left, including Illinois Senator Barack Obama, supports -- abandoning to its deliberate death a child that survived a late term abortion -- is first degree homicide in any rational society.
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mrgybe



Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 2644

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gurgle, Great wisdom from the North of England......if there are no consequences for unwise actions, respect and caution evaporates. There are 1.5 million abortions a year in the US.........42 million a year worldwide. Most are a lifestyle choice as you say. This from our favorite fount of knowledge.......

"A 1998 aggregated study, from 27 countries, on the reasons women seek to terminate their pregnancies concluded that common factors cited to have influenced the abortion decision were: desire to delay or end childbearing, concern over the interruption of work or education, issues of financial or relationship stability, and perceived immaturity.[71] A 2004 study in which American women at clinics answered a questionnaire yielded similar results" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion#Incidence

Chandler..........the 46 million in the US since Roe v Wade can be found in a thousand places on the web.
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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 1067

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan
I do not think my light hearted post was trying to provoke a fight, but if that is what you would like, that’s fine with me. I should have know better to think a lefty from Boston would not have a better perspective of what its like to be a southern man and be labeled a racist for action he denounces , and did not participate in. And my response to your history lesson was also light hearted. I love music , and do mention it often, you should give it a try, I find it very therapeutic. But if you want to call someone a hypocrite , look no further than your pal obama. He brings the word to a new meaning.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5204

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mrgybe’s attacks on Planned Parenthood come directly from a religious right group, focus on the family, that boasts that they give you the pro-family outlook that you won’t get from mainstream media. But as usual, it is a set of cherry picked facts spun as part of an anti-women, anti-poor campaign.

Focus on family reports that "1 in ten women who are Planned Parenthood clients have abortions." Seems to me that that is actually half the number of pregnancies that are terminated by abortion (20%). So I would take those facts and suggest that funding a group that educates women who might not otherwise have access to healthcare, with results that seem to halve the abortion rate, is a pretty good investment.

According to their Executive Director, “Planned Parenthood serves three million women every year through its more than 850 affiliate health centers across the country”

Mrgybe spins that number to a "shocking conclusion" that 330,000 out of 340,000 women get abortions. No, 330,000 out of 3 million get abortions. The rest get information about avoiding pregnancies and it seems to work. Planned Paarenthood is, for many, the last resort for an unwanted pregnancy as the religious right has lobbied for restrictions in most states and threatened and killed doctors who perform abortions. It is where a desperate woman without health care has to go, but treat the numbers with integrity.

Quote:
Sixty percent of women who go to Planned Parenthood and similar health centers report that this is their only source of health care, of any kind http://beta.toledoblade.com/Op-Ed-Columns/2011/03/29/Attack-on-Planned-Parenthood-threatens-women-s-health.html


It is ironic that mrgybe has chided us in the past that we are not fully supportive of women. Yet the typical attitude of the far right can be found in mrgybe's support for restricting a woman's choice, an attitude found so succinctly in Mike Fick's claim that women give up the right to choose when they have sex. The right has opposed abortion even in the case of rape--a matter of choice? This is a war on women and the poor, and the use of lies to fight the battles are supported and justified by the far right.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1944
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
Dan
I do not think my light hearted post was trying to provoke a fight, but if that is what you would like, that’s fine with me. I should have know better to think a lefty from Boston would not have a better perspective of what its like to be a southern man and be labeled a racist for action he denounces , and did not participate in. And my response to your history lesson was also light hearted. I love music , and do mention it often, you should give it a try, I find it very therapeutic. But if you want to call someone a hypocrite , look no further than your pal obama. He brings the word to a new meaning.


Matt, I maintain that you probably are a great guy in person. Don't get me wrong on that. We might've even sailed together at some time and enjoyed the camaraderie of windsurfing. Awesome enough, and I love music, too.

I just assume that a person who posts inside an existing thread, especially one who's been active in that thread, would not post something totally off-topic to the thread unless that person wanted to imply a point germane to the topic. That is why I concluded that you were trying to make a political point by introducing the song and commenting on its meaning, a meaning undeniably political.

Again, I lived in Kentucky for four years. From that, I think I understand a little of what many people perceive on both sides of the "Southern" identity issue. Some from the Northeast absurdly believe everyone in former slave states is a racist and ready to join the KKK. Some in the former slave states believe everyone in the Northeast is a Marxist and kills fetuses for fun. Neither point is true. I find, however, that people (invariably Caucasian) from former slave states fly the Confederate Battle Flag are intentionally communicating their affection for the Confederacy.

Even the Dukes of Hazzard (staged in a very rural KY county) poked fun at that flag and those who use it as a form of twisted patriotism by emblazoning it on the Dodge Charger named, ironically, the General Lee. I don't get my underwear in a twist when seeing images from the show because it was very subversive in its comedy.

Given that, is it so odd to ask whether real people who celebrate that flag either are racist, forgot what they should've learned in school or merely ignorant of the meaning of that flag to most people in the USA and around the world?

People in the South are no different than you or me when it comes down to it. That's why I find the celebration of the Confederate Battle Flag so troubling and a topic not really addressed in that song.
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