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obamas freeloading aunt
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3017

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think mike is a good person but has been drawn into the Talk radio cult. When pressed he often modifies his stated opinion into something quite reasonable.
If he would say"yeah you guys have a point" or" I hear this stuff on the radio but they are often pumping up golfballs at us."
and move to the final version like with education then he wouldn't offend so many folks.
He would need to realize how often he supplies others with opinions so he can attack that opinion. Compared to talk he only does it a little but every event makes folks uncomfortable. We want to feel we are actually speaking to another person, not standing next to Limbaugh mumbling to himself from a script.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5435

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frankly keycocker, I can't agree with your view about isobars. His history proves that he's incapable of getting along with others, and is totally incorrigible about changing his ways.

However, I've always said that if he can sophisticate and temper his arguments, he might have a chance at some credibility. Of course, that also means he must admit when he is wrong about the facts, but he's been to be quite incapable of that kind of honesty and humility.

Moreover, his acts of censorship, and boldly bragging about it too, are unquestionably un-American in nature. I continue to hang tough on this point because it's so important.. We must recollect, that he's been very negatively outspoken about the Obama Administration and Democrats in Congress working to essentially ban right wing talk radio. The guy needs to look at himself and his actions more honestly.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4648

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I enjoy a reasoned argument that makes me re-think my assumptions. Mike almost never makes one. mrgybe did at first, but has some huge blind spots--DDT and oil companies. Mike is like people that I fired. They don't read critically, instead only read for what matches their biases, jump to conclusions, and aren't willing to duel substantive issues. He first called me a liar when I checked out an actual reference on global warming. It turned out then, as often since then, that he had either misquoted or selectively quoted the source. There are different names for the disorder, but for me it is simply the lack of critical thinking, and the excessive anger. He has tried to threaten me, or out me, when I have no reason to be hidden. So I won't give him a pass. If I'm going to ingest right wing thinking, I go for George Will, who often has something useful to say. Isobars? Not so much.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4648

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

matty said:
Quote:
love the way you liberals always find a way to make some freeloader , or thug the victim.
Reminds me of the kid who killed his two parents, and then whined about being an orphan.


What a scream. Hoary old quote, not very original. I certainly don't make Obama's aunt a victim. But the story doesn't remotely make your original point. I think it is wonderful how this country lets a guy who can't reason and spends his nights killing brain cells in a local bar vote. Strong enough to survive that.

But what would I expect from someone who rationalizes torture. My parents taught me that lying is shameful, and it has been my experience that most people don't lie. But those who do invariably think that everyone lies. Sounds like your arguments about torture. Sounds like someone who doesn't really know the difference between right and wrong.
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1385

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:

And you people want the government running even MORE of your lives? Fine ... move to Sweden or Germany and stop f-ing up our country.


Germany did quite well in the recent financial crisis. Hmm...

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13270

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coboardhead wrote:
This has not been widely reported, outside of the medical journals.


It's all over Fox News and conservative TR, with great emphasis.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13270

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MULLDE102f wrote:
You're trying to avoid the real issues, Mike. The outrageous cost of the BS in Iraq (and currently, Afghanistan) completely eclipses the comparatively minor effects of the few people that game the system. I'm pretty sure that the scams on the military budget dwarf anything done on social programs.

By the way, you do realize that the VA benefits you use are a social program, don’t you?


"Social program"? How about outright socialized medicine, by definition? It's a glaring example, rubbed in our noses by the administration as a model for Ocare, of some of the worst failings of non-competitive medicine and management thereof. I'm many years and dozens of substantive pages ahead of you on that issue. In addition to being worried about my very life due to VA incompetency (in just one example, one literally criminally incompetent VA physician has probably signed my death warrant) at multiple VA locations from Walla Wallla to Washington, D.C., dealing with its administrative nightmares has consumed man-months of my time. You wouldn't belie ... oh, don't get me started.

Bottom line: the VA is why I buy other health care insurance,
why I study medical and health literature by the pound,
why I so so strongly and so often insist in writing that fellow cancer patient vets seek care beyond the VA,
why every health care practitioner I consult expresses surprise at my knowledge,
why several physicians have incorporated my medical observations, analyses, and even treatment protocols into my medical records and in some cases to their body of knowledge,
why I keep copies of all my medical records,
why I rely on VA practitioners only for benign services, and
why all of you should fear Obamacare. I am convinced from decades of personal experience with Ocare's VA model that Ocare will gravely impact or even ruin many of your children's lives, maybe even your own. Managing your own care with great diligence, expertise, and legal might may save your life and the quality thereof.

Back to welfare: The "few" people that game the system? Medicare fraud alone costs over $60B annually; Harvard expert Malcolm Sparrow says it exceeds $85B. Sparrow argues that annual health care fraud and abuse might be as low as one hundred billion, more likely two or three, possibly four or five hundred billion (Malcolm Sparrow, “Criminal Prosecution as a Deterrent to Health Care Fraud,” Testimony to the Senate Committee on the Judiciary, Subcommittee on Crime and Drugs, May 20, 2009). That alone approaches or well exceeds the dollar costs of the I and A wars including the fraud. Then Google something like welfare fraud costs and knock your socks off. You might start with http://tinyurl.com/298jons ; its cited references will keep you busy for hours.

Our education only begins with school, whether it's first grade or post-doc research. The rest of it is up to us to pursue
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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 1033

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mac , always with the personal attacks. It must be such a burden to always be the smartest guy in the room. Do you hold your head up and give that glare of supremacy like obama does?
I would much rather hang out at a bar , with people you find inferior, than a pompous elitist like yourself. You may be a bight guy , but you are sadly out of touch with most Americans. You continue to defend your lefty ways , while your state is drowning , must ba Arnolds fault , right?

27 DAYS
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1847

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coboardhead wrote:
"This has not been widely reported, outside of the medical journals. "


Isobars wrote "It's all over Fox News and conservative TR, with great emphasis."

I guess I missed it on Fox News. So, there has been a discussion on talk radio about the long term effects of these wars on the long term physical, psychological and structural damage to the FAMILIES of our soldiers who have been gravely injured?

This may convince me to tune in more often. What would be the best program?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13270

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coboardhead wrote:
1. There has been a discussion on talk radio about the long term effects of these wars on the long term physical, psychological and structural damage to the FAMILIES of our soldiers who have been gravely injured?

2. This may convince me to tune in more often. What would be the best program?


1. Many times, on many programs, with many families and many vets. Huckabee interviews them often on his weekend evening show, for example.

2. Short answer for Fox News and TR newbies:
I'd suggest you start with Fox's O'Reilly and TR's Medved for current events, plus Fox News' Cavuto and/or any Fox Business Network shows for, uh, business news and analysis. Warning: O'Reilly has hard and fast rules for his guests (who, BTW, are numerically carefully balanced between the left and the right); they ignore them at their own peril. His rules are:
• Thou shalt not filibuster.
• Thou shall answer the host's questions.
• Thou shalt not defame anyone without proof and relevance.
• When you've made your point, stop talking or I will talk over you; the seconds hand is ticking and viewers' attention span is microscopic.

The longer answer:

For straight news, Shepard Smith and the top half of Special Report with Bret Baier come to mind (Special Report was rated by left-funded research as solidly centrist). Baier's second half digs into current events analysis heavily. hat show's previous anchor Brit Hume, still all over Fox News, is one of America's most highly rated newsmen. For insightful and in-depth (by TV standards) interviews on important topics, Greta Susteren is an impressive interviewer (she has apparently abandoned her stupid Tragedy TV nonsense). She completely gutted Gloria Allred a couple of days ago on the Meg Whitman housekeeper charges. Bill O'Reilly keeps edging his news analysis show's sliding scale ever more towards more facts/fewer opinions as his poll and viewer dominance figures keep climbing; he absolutely dominates cable news and often beats the broadcast TV new shows in viewership rankings. One example at http://tinyurl.com/25dqmdx begins with
"Fox News came out on top of all its competitors and many other media sources recently on a Battleground poll conducted by Politico and George Washington University in terms of both general popularity and positive reputation among likely voters. While Bill O’Reilly was not surprised by the influence he found his network had, guest Bernie Goldberg was more skeptical: how to believe a survey that says O’Reilly is better known than Ed Schultz?" . Given NBC owner Jeffrey Immelt's history of and investigation for what is effectively arms dealing with Iran and his blatant network support of Obama, that's no surprise. Hannity? Over the top, but he does present and often back up with government agency figures many conservative points we won't see anywhere else. Neil Cavuto's business show, and the whole Fox Business channel, hit the economic facts, figures, forecasts, and opinions heavily. Oooooh, yes ... Glenn Beck; a hoot to watch, a provocateur nonpareil among Fox hosts, the most though-provoking pundit I've seen on TV, and maybe even often right.

On TR, history and current events savant Michael Medved stands heads and shoulders above the crowd in credibility. Libertarian Neal Boortz is often fun, often informative, and when he goes on one of his patented rants of logic, hard to dispute. His book, "Somebody's Got to Say It" will give you an introduction to his logical approach to the world, and his Fair Tax books explain that in great detail. I've tried to listen to several left wing TR shows for a reality check, but even Ellis Hennican shot his genre in the foot quickly.

Take Fox TV with a grain of salt and TR with a bag of salt, but take their detractors' uninformed blanket blasts at both with the Bonneville Salt Flats and try something truly radical: check them out for yourself. You will notice that most of those shows, unlike most left wing hosts like Olbermann, Mathews, et.al., welcome and treat with respect opinions and guests from both sides of the fence. All of them criticized Bush and crew very harshly when they were relevant, and O'Reilly in particular is only just now "getting it" how flawed Obama's policies are; he has inexplicably kissed O's royal butt for almost two years now.

Why listen to any conservative or centrist news, news analysis, or opinion shows? Because the good ones introduce and discuss topics and facts we do not hear on the very left-leaning mainstream media for weeks or months, if at all. Many important news stories detrimental to the liberal cause are not covered until, sometimes unless, neutral or conservative sources embarrass the left into mentioning them begrudgingly, briefly, and only with great bias. How much, and when, for example, did the mainstream media discuss the highly authoritative congressional testimony lambasting the DOJ for deliberately and institutionally prohibiting voter intimidation prosecution if the victims are white but pushing it hard if the victims are minority? Have you seen on NBC the armed, uniformed, BIG Black Panther goons threatening whites trying to cast votes? Has Olbermann aired one of those same Panthers bullhorning exhortations of the public to start killing crackers and their babies? Did Maddow reveal the expert firsthand testimony that after those Panthers plead guilty to the charges, Holder ordered the DOJ to drop the charges, citing a claim that voter rights apply only to minorities? Maybe more important in the grand scheme of news bias, when did any of this sordid, shameful story air on the alphabet "news" channels ... last week? It's been on Fox for nearly a year.

You're welcome to read these iW forums' progressive freaks' Olbermann- and Franken-based, invalid, talking-point, uninformed venom sure to follow regarding this post, but believing their vitriol without first-hand observation of a few of each of those shows should embarrass you. And, no, I'm not going to debate them about this topic; it's pointless. No media or hosts are 90% credible, but these guys and gal here rank below my dumber dog on both the ken scale and the tolerance scale.


Last edited by isobars on Tue Oct 05, 2010 5:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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