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The Roll of Government?
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14605

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

keycocker wrote:
1. I finally had enough when his" absolutely right " extended to telling us that Obama is part of lifelong Commie anti american conspiracy that has finally elected one of their traitors to the highest office in the land.

2. As Patriots we would have to lay down our sails and join the guys who are planning to kill men in uniform at funerals to save us from a gov taken over by the enemy.


#1 is a deliberate baldfaced lie and KC knows it. It's disgusting to realize that someone who behaves like that actually teaches children in a classroom.

#2 is simply puzzling; it makes no sense. Its only implication is that the teacher also does drugs; is there any other explanation?
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3751
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
Potholes could be filled by private contractors, and electric fencing wiring would deter any errant kiter from peeing on the ground --- twice -- anywhere we deploy said hardware.

The Bard is correct. The Constitution specifically limits the federal government's rights. Ever notice that? It GIVES the federal government NO rights over the citizens at large other than taxation; its sole function is to PROTECT our inherent rights from government intrusion. It doesn't even give us a right to vote in a presidential election; that right is limited to the electoral college.

Mike \m/

Hey Fick, would the 12 MIdnight rush to save Terry Shiavo's life in Florida be included in your Federal GOVT intrusion meme?
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3538

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I spoke to Fick with respect when nearly every other person simply traded insults with him. This is my reward for showing respect.
After that business of Obama being a lifelong anti american Commie I respectfully asked that he remove me from his screen as he pretends to do with most other posters.
Instead I get this.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5560

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan--I love your name for Iso, Mr. Fiction. Isobars claimed:
Quote:
The Bard is correct. The Constitution specifically limits the federal government's rights. Ever notice that? It GIVES the federal government NO rights over the citizens at large other than taxation; its sole function is to PROTECT our inherent rights from government intrusion. It doesn't even give us a right to vote in a presidential election; that right is limited to the electoral college.


That's so ignorant it would be funny if it weren't becoming common cant among the right. First a bit of history. Before there was a United States joined through a constitution, there was a federation of states, where the central government held almost no power. Establishing a greater power base for the Federal government was the main purpose of the US Constitution, and the lunatic fringe now is repeating in large parts the arguments of those who lost the argument back then. (Of course, we see that their commitment to the Constitution is pretty weak when it comes to citizenship, separation of church and state, and the commerce clause.)
At that time, the concerns that the central government would usurp state authority and result in loss of freedoms led to the Bill of Rights, which was the essential compromise among the parties that resulted in the establishment of a Constitutional Government in this country. Anyone who paid a bit of attention in high school should know this stuff cold.

Second, Iso and Bard and others ignore the Commerce Clause. I won't repeat it, you can find it in Bard's post--although I bet he is neither familiar with it or the body of law that relies upon that clause. To paraphrase, the founding fathers believed that it made sense to have a certain level of continuity in those laws that governed commerce--tarrifs between the states was a big issue at the time. So they vested that authority in the Federal government. The courts have consistently interpretted the scope of commerce to be very broad, and it forms the basis for much of modern law and regulation. But I will give a simple example that belies bard's conclusion and paranoia, and that is the Interstate Highway system. In the 1950's, with that Republican President Dwight Eisenhower in office, Congress decided that a nationwide system of highways was in the public interest. They established a system that would fund such a road network, that could either utilize State highways or not, but relied on cooperation with State governments. I dare say that there is not a single person in this country who has not either driven on an Interstate Highway, or benefited from the lower cost of transporting goods.

For you dinosaurs out there, we transported goods by wagon when the Constitution was written. There weren't railroads, cars, trucks or airplanes. The idea that the notion of commerce should be frozen along with the technology of the late 18th century is pretty bizarre. Fortunately the courts don't share your views.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14605

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

keycocker wrote:
I spoke to Fick with respect


How is deliberately fabricating an onerous statement from me "respect"?
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 6022

PostPosted: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think about this one. isobars claims to see so little of what goes on here, based on his own bold claims of broad censorship (18 folks to date), but he's ready and hot to do the barnyard rooster thing on keycocker.

We are all well aware of isobars' history of commentary, and that keycocker is right on target in characterizing isobars' bent theme.

isobars must think that folks aren't looking. How crazy is that!
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5560

PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let’s look at what Bobby Jindal thinks about the role of government. But be prepared for whiplash. When an economic stimulus was being debated, Bobby said:
Quote:
"In the end, it comes down to an honest and fundamental disagreement about the proper role of government. We oppose the national Democratic view that says the way to strengthen our country is to increase dependence on government. We believe the way to strengthen our country is to restrain spending in Washington, to empower individuals and small businesses to grow our economy and create jobs."
After the oil spill:
Quote:
Gov. Bobby Jindal of Louisiana declared a state of emergency and mobilized the Louisiana National Guard to participate in response efforts.

On Friday, he also requested federal assistance for state fishermen, asking the Secretary of Commerce to declare a commercial fisheries failure.

But don’t worry, he flip –flopped again, and is arguing for renewed drilling because the regulations in place are sufficient.

From Salon:
Quote:
Jindal omnisciently -- and mistakenly -- asserts here that current federal regulations are sufficient to avoid another blowout disaster. He has no way of knowing if this is true, whereas we have every reason to believe it is false.
Under the Cheney-Bush administration, efforts to strengthen regulation were blocked and the industry demanded and achieved essentially voluntary, "trust us" self-regulation and self-certification. For instance, when the Minerals Management Service considered requiring an acoustic backup system to shut off the blowout preventer in the event of a disaster, as Brazil and Norway require, lobbying by BP and other oil companies persuaded them not to.
The Wall Street Journal reported that "the safety record of U.S. offshore drilling compares unfavorably, in terms of deaths and serious accidents, to other major oil-producing countries. Over the past five years, an offshore oil worker in the U.S. was more than four times as likely to be killed than a worker in European waters, and 23% more likely to sustain an injury." A 2007 MMS study of 39 blowouts from 1992 to 2006 found, "Nearly all the blowouts examined occurred in the Gulf of Mexico." Big Oil clearly can't be trusted to regulate itself.
That's why some are calling this disaster "Cheney's Katrina." And that's why Obama set up a commission to figure out exactly why this disaster occurred. Until we know all the causes, we can't be sure we are taking every possible step to make sure it doesn't happen again. And that's why the president put in place the moratorium for six months, to wait until the findings from the commission are in. That's also why the president on Tuesday called the disaster a wakeup call that should lead us to once and for all end our addiction to oil.


Now after the Texas oilmen made the Minerals Management System a candy store for big oil (pig oil?) we have wizards like bard blaming Obama--and then claiming that the answer for everything is to cut regulations.

Windoggie--it's about the money isn't it?
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1398

PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mac wrote:

Windoggie--it's about the money isn't it?


Yes, it is. Looks like the roll of Government is bankrolling the red states with our federal taxes:

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/266.htm

_________________
florian - ny22

http://www.windsurfing.kasail.com/
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yeeeeha



Joined: 19 Jun 2000
Posts: 28
Location: Deep in the woods

PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This mini-documentary uses government data to show how federal, state, and local governments are in fiscal trouble in most part, because of excessive pay for a bloated civil service.

There are way too many government workers and they get paid way too much.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzd3puYmiM&feature=player
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4336

PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a bit of joy on this May Day when tens of thousands of criminal aliens have taken over the streets of many of our cities. This is frightening. What was once a mostly silent invasion is no longer silent and is far more of a threat to our culture, language, and borders than any Arab nation ever could be. See "la reconquista" (the reconquest) below. We are being taken over from within without a shot being fired! (as they boast) These people don't appreciate our kindness, instead interpreting it as a sign of weakness that they intend to exploit. They loathe us! They see us as spineless weaklings to be scorned and ridiculed. Also, "La Raza" (the race) an organization of Mexican activists, would call us racists if we had an organization called "White Power" or anything similar to that.
(See the comments below of foreign born speakers in California).


Subject: "YOU OLD WHITE PEOPLE"

Can you believe this!!??

"You old white people. It is your duty to die."

HISPANIC LEADERS SPEAK OUT!

Augustin Cebada, Brown Berets; "Go back to Boston! Go back to Plymouth Rock, Pilgrims! Get out! We are the future. You are old and tired. Go on. We have beaten you. Leave like beaten rats. You old white people. It is your duty to die . . Through love of having children, we are going to take over.

Richard Alatorre, Los Angeles City Council. "They're afraid we're
going to take over the governmental institutions and other institutions. They're right. We will take them over . . . We are here to stay."

Excelsior, the national newspaper of Mexico, "The American Southwest seems to be slowly returning to the jurisdiction of Mexico without firing a single shot."

Professor Jose Angel Gutierrez, University of Texas; "We have an aging white America. They are not making babies. They are dying. The explosion is in our population . . . I love it. They are shitting in their pants with fear. I love it."

Art Torres, Chairman of the California Democratic Party, "Remember 187--proposition to deny taxpayer funds for services to non-citizens--was the last gasp of white America in California."

Gloria Molina, Los Angeles County Supervisor, "We are politicizing every single one of these new citizens that are becoming citizens of this country . . . I gotta tell you that a lot of people are saying, "I'm going to go out there and vote because I want to pay them back."

Mario Obledo, California Coalition of Hispanic Organizations and
California State Secretary of Health, Education and Welfare under
Governor Jerry Brown, also awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Bill Clinton, "California is going to be a Hispanic state. Anyone who doesn't like it should leave."

Jose Pescador Osuna, Mexican Consul General , "We are practicing 'La Reconquista' in California."

Professor Fernando Guerra, Loyola Marymount University; "We need to avoid a white backlash by using codes understood by Latinos . . . "

Are these just the words of a few extremists? Consider that we could fill up many pages with such quotes. Also, consider that these are mainstream Mexican leaders.

THE U.S. VS MEXICO:
On February 15, 1998, the U.S. and Mexican soccer teams met at the Los Angeles Coliseum. The crowd was overwhelmingly pro-Mexican even though most lived in this country. They booed during the National Anthem and U.S. flags were held up side down. As the match progressed, supporters of the U.S. team were insulted, pelted with projectiles, punched and spat upon. Beer and trash were thrown at the U.S. players before and after
the match. The coach of the U.S. team, Steve Sampson said, "This was the most painful experience I have ever had in this profession."

Did you know that immigrants from Mexico and other non-European countries can come to this country and get preferences in jobs, education, and government contracts? It's called affirmative action or racial privilege. The Emperor of Japan or the President of Mexico could migrate here and immediately be eligible for special rights unavailable for Americans of European descent. Recently, a vote was taken in the U.S. Congress to end this practice. It was defeated. Every single Democratic senator
except Ernest Hollings voted to maintain special privileges for Hispanic, Asian and African immigrants. They were joined by thirteen Republicans. Bill Clinton and Al Gore have repeatedly stated that they believe that massive immigration from countries like Mexico is good. They have also backed special privileges for these immigrants.

Corporate America has signed on to the idea that minorities and third world immigrants should get special, privileged status. Some examples are Exxon, Texaco, Merrill Lynch, Boeing, Paine Weber, Starbucks and many more.

DID YOU KNOW?:
Did you know that Mexico regularly intercedes on the side of the
defense in criminal cases involving Mexican nationals? Did you know that Mexico has NEVER extradited a Mexican national accused of murder in the U.S. in spite of agreements to do so? According to the L.A. Times, Orange County, California is home to 275 gangs with 17,000 members; 98% of which are Mexican and Asian. How's your county doing?

According to a New York Times article dated May 19, 1994, 20 years after the great influx of legal immigrants from Southeast Asia, 30% are still on welfare compared to 8% of households nationwide. A Wall Street Journal editorial dated December 5, 1994 quotes law enforcement officials as stating that Asian mobsters are the "greatest criminal challenge the country faces." Not bad for a group that is still under 5% of the population.

Is education important to you? Here are the words of a teacher who spent over 20 years in the Los Angeles School system. "Imagine teachers in classes containing 30-40 students of widely varying attention spans and motivation, many of whom aren't fluent in English.

Educators seek learning materials likely to reach the majority of
students and that means fewer words and math problems and more pictures and multicultural references."

WHEN I WAS YOUNG:
When I was young, I remember hearing about the immigrants that came through Ellis Island. They wanted to learn English. They wanted to breath free. They wanted to become Americans. Now too many immigrants come here with demands. They demand to be taught in their own language. They demand special privileges--affirmative action. They demand ethnic studies that glorify their culture.

HOW CAN YOU HELP?:
Send copies of this letter to at least two other people, 100 would be even better. Help us get the word out.

California Coalition for Immigration Reform
5942 Edinger, Suite 113-117
Huntington Beach, CA 92649
Phone 714 921 7142
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