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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 6485
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:


They certainly and repeatedly say it should not last, but until then .....

It might get colder.
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MalibuGuru



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 9288

PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

youwindsurf wrote:
stevenbard wrote:
Of course it's politics KC. The POLITICIANS want the middle class's money. Because you'd have to be crazy to think a politician would do anything, for anybody, but himself.


Correction - It is the Oligarchs who bought the politicians who want all of the money from the middle class. You're right, politicians don't do anything for themselves, they do it for their Oligarch masters.

Maybe trickle down economics does work. The Oligarchs trickle money down to the politicians who do their bidding.


I do believe we are on the same page. A smaller central government with a stronger local government would take care of this. And, a flat 2 tier tax system with no IRS would also stomp out their influence. A 10% tax up to $1 million with 20% over a million would seem fair to me. No deductions at all.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 17736
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, yeah. Do the math, tell me the numbers, and tell me how you will get the votes to eliminate which programs.

Too much tequila with NW, too little thinking and fact checking.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935

PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
a flat 2 tier tax system with no IRS would also stomp out their influence. A 10% tax up to $1 million with 20% over a million would seem fair to me. No deductions at all.

Have you studied the Fair Tax .... the most studied and most promising tax system ever proposed? No one here (or apparently virtually anywhere) can or has come up with a VALID objection yet; so far, after years of research into it, its critics criticize only rumors and lies about it, often despite knowing their claims are false. Every American owes it to himself and his country to look into the Fair Tax WEBSITE and Boortz/Linden's books on it -- NOT the fabricated versions posted and broadcast elsewhere -- and demand its passage.


Last edited by isobars on Sat Oct 04, 2014 9:15 am; edited 1 time in total
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LHDR



Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 528

PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:
LHDR (quote), 'A good start would be to track the total area during the year in which conditions stray by three standard deviations from the local and seasonal means.'

But what are the seasonal means in 'chaotic' climates/weather systems such as we (Britain) experience? (Confluence of three air masses -polar, maritime, continental - which are all affected by the position of the jet stream.) ...

I agree, weather is more variable in Britain than elsewhere, and local effects of climate change are going to be bigger or more obvious in some parts of the world than others. Just to make sure, the authors' idea of tracking areas with "extreme" events is still valid, because they propose to track conditions that stray by three standard deviations from the means. So in Britain, the standard deviation for, let's say temperature, would be larger than elsewhere and consequently, a larger deviation from the mean (compared to elsewhere) would be required in order to get counted as an "extreme" event.

Unrelated: I added a jpg image to the previous post and noticed that I only see the image when logged in, not when I am logged out. On the other hand, I can see jpg images over at the windsurfing forum even when logged out. I can't think of a good reason for this, is it a bug? I also noticed that pueno posted an article with graphics on p344 this thread, much more elegant than jpg attachments. How do you do that?
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2643

PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you LHDR. Your presentation is very valid.

It isn't ignorance on our part (Britain) to doubt the accuracy of 'warmest wailing', but natural scepticism. When you live in a highly variable weather/climate environment which can produce a heatwave one week, and winter the next (whatever the nominal season) you tend to say 'bugger this' and argue about something else. (We gave up sacrificing 20 virgins a time at Stonehenge to appease the weather gods some few decades ago - non were available anymore!)

I know I keep harping on it, but the extent or otherwise of the Arctic ice must always have depended on the earths average atmospheric temperature, throughout geological history. Since many geological periods, some lasting for millions of years, have been warmer than todays world, we cannot be certain what Arctic ice conditions could be considered normal. We are still bouncing back from the last ice age.

Even in human history of a mere few thousands of years there have been warming and cooling cycles. (Greenland Viking farming settlements - till reversion to cold wiped them out.) So for me, the argument isn't so much are we creating warming, as what is 'normal' for the earth anyway?
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 6485
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:
So for me, the argument isn't so much are we creating warming, as what is 'normal' for the earth anyway?

That is a question that has never been answered, primarily because it's impossible, and will probably never be answered, it's too defined, unlike Global Warming.
But in the meantime we can look forward to this questionable effort.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scientists to 'fast-track' evidence linking extreme weather to climate change in sign of panic that they're losing propaganda battle to the sceptics
Scientists have created a new tool for linking climate change to weather
The model should be fully operational by next year according to experts
Scientists will be able to link adverse weather to climate change in 3 days

By Darren Boyle for MailOnline

Published: 11:00 EST, 4 October 2014 | Updated: 11:15 EST, 4 October 2014


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2780587/Scientists-fast-track-evidence-linking-extreme-weather-climate-change-sign-panic-losing-propaganda-battle-sceptics.html#ixzz3FEBjKTz9
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gotta love the term "propaganda battle".
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2643

PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote



Last edited by GURGLETROUSERS on Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2643

PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the subject of sacrificial lambs NW, I propose we nominate you, for starting this vexatious thread! ( Wink Wink )

It prAbably (a Brucie-ism) wouldn't affect the weather/climate much, but may just soothe the feelings and frequent bouts of digestive indignation and abuse hurling your way, in those who take your presence here personally.

Keep the fire burning NW. (We may need the heat in future! Laughing Laughing Laughing )
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 6485
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, and I will.

Still trying to have it both ways, 'the growing ice isn't in the right place, so it doesn't count', sorry but ice is ice, and it takes very low temps to make it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Antarctic sea ice hits record levels as it reaches 20 MILLION square kilometers for time time since records began in 1979
Now covers more of the southern oceans than it has since scientists began records in 1979
Single-day maximum extent this year was reached on Sept. 20 when the sea ice covered 7.78 million square miles

Published: 16:24 EST, 7 October 2014 | Updated: 17:34 EST, 7 October 2014


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2784196/Sea-ice-surrounding-Antarctica-reaches-record-levels-hits-20-MILLION-square-kilometers.html#ixzz3FVRB77yo
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gotta love the last lines of the article~

'The Antarctic sea ice is one of those areas where things have not gone entirely as expected.
'So it's natural for scientists to ask, 'OK, this isn't what we expected, now how can we explain it?'
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