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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1395

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

2013 had one of the coldest winters and spring periods on record and "global warming" was made a joke again. That was the focus of public and media attention in 2013 and all but forgotten was the Moscow heat wave of 2010, the massive draughts and forest fires:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-10912658

Kotlyakov - a Geographer, not a meteorologist or paleoclimateologist - seems most interested in getting funding for his studies of glaciers: http://en.ria.ru/science/20130118/178865212.html.

In his view, colder and drier periods starve glaciers of precipitation and therefore are most responsible for the retreat of glacial ice:
http://unchronicle.un.org/article/global-warming-and-surging-glaciers/

I don't see any dismissal of anthropogenic sources of climate change here, only a guess as to how much of an impact they have overall. No one can make quantitative predictions, neither he or the IPPC or anyone else at this point. Instead of taking his very sharply focussed field of research as an opportunity to dismiss most climateologists warnings, it would make most sense to follow the scientific discourse more closely.

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Last edited by feuser on Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1392

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am suitably rebuked, Mac and Feuser. Crying or Very sad

(Last post on this confounded computer set up!!!!)
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5477

PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GT--no need to feel rebuked. As someone involved in setting policy on responding to global warming in California, I feel a responsibility to take serious challenges to conventional thinking seriously. I try to make sure that I understand the gist of each argument that is raised by skeptics, and evaluate the credibility of the sources and the underlying data. While something like 97% of scientists working on climate believe that the evidence of human-caused climate change is compelling, and while there is an active denier industry funded by energy companies that have no compunctions about funding liars, that doesn't mean that the remaining 3% don't have valid points. Certainly the odds are better that they are right than on any lottery!


I have chased down a lot of stories that trace back to disinformation factories, but have also gotten some interesting perspectives. I've named the more credible and persuasive skeptics on this forum.

The frantic, particularly folks like Isobars, don't even appear to understand the argument. Iso has misquoted Fred Singer, and cited Bjorn Lomborg, without understanding that he nearly completely changed his viewpoint in his second book. Lomborg is, of course, a shit stirring political scientist, fond of poking and belittling environmental causes--and sloppy in his work. See http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=skepticism-toward-the-ske\
A careful reading of Lomborg's work reveals that he understands that global warming is happening, and is largely due to human causes. In his first book on global warming he made some rather wild claims that a warmer planet would save lives, and in his second book on warming he told us he could fix the problem cheaply. See http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/aug/30/bjorn-lomborg-climate-change-profile

Political scientists and economists may be well qualified to tell us how best to respond to climate change without ruining the economy, but they are hardly scientists capable of creating peer reviewed literature on the subject. Particularly those like Lomborg who know that being controversial and confrontational, and telling conservatives what they want to believe, will help him sell his many books.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5477

PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very funny:

http://www.upworthy.com/this-is-probably-the-funniest-most-effective-way-to-deal-with-people-who-ignore-science-facts-ever-2?g=4
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1860
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been awhile since I've posted on my aptly named thread, but the British (as well as some here) will have nothing to do with this global cooling talk, nothing whatsoever, no matter what!

Climate change warning: Killer winter storms for next THIRTY years

KILLER freezes, floods and heatwaves will devastate Britain during the next 30 years, climate ­experts have warned.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/354006/Climate-change-warning-Killer-winter-storms-for-next-THIRTY-years

It wasn't that long ago that the "scientists" from the University of East Anglia were saying that our children won't even know what snow looks like.
It didn't take long to back away from that.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
And then there is this~

Cold dis-comfort: Antarctica set record of -135.8

By SETH BORENSTEIN
— Dec. 9, 2013 7:23 PM EST

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/cold-dis-comfort-antarctica-set-record-1358

But of course they do a CYA at the end of the article with this~
"Just because one spot on Earth has set records for cold that has little to do with global warming because it is one spot in one place, said Waleed Abdalati, an ice scientist at the University of Colorado and NASA's former chief scientist. Both Abdalati, who wasn't part of the measurement team, and Scambos said this is likely an unusual random reading in a place that hasn't been measured much before and could have been colder or hotter in the past and we wouldn't know."

Which is both classic and expected, you should read the comments.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Just one more, like I said, it's been awhile since I've posted on this thread.

Cold rewrites Oregon history books
Coldest temps in a quarter-century

By KOIN 6 News Staff
Updated: Sunday, December 8, 2013, 7:13 AM PST

http://www.koin.com/news/oregon/oregon-cold-snap-120713
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I know, I know mac, I'm talking weather, but like I've said before, it must really suck that the weather keeps getting in the way of global warming.
The climate just won't behave like it's supposed to.
Damn it! Fu(king weather!!!

Hea, at least I didn't point out the Eagles vs. Lions game from yesterday, that was awesome, one of the most entertaining games I've watched in years.

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5477

PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So you know you're posting something that doesn't matter? Great accomplishment. Well worth the effort.
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1860
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mac, I should just set my watch by you.
What do you do, camp out here?

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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1392

PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tut tut NW!

The Daily Star is a tits and bums rag for the educationally sub normal. It will print anything to get attention. (They see that most of the British press is sceptical, so take the exaggerated reverse stance.)

By the way, the latest tidal storm surge (freak event) was surpassed by that of 1953. (Pre warming hysteria days.) Then, much of Holland lay under water as the dykes were breached. A report at the time (doctored for effect no doubt - the press is the press) described how an elderly couple were sitting on their roof, surrounded by the sea, when a helicopter flew in to rescue.

The story went; the crew lowered a rope and harness, but the couple mistook the purpose so tied it to the chimney stack to tether the copter, then went back inside to brew a cup of tea. (It was the British press, after all, but nice to see that nothing has changed in the meanwhile!) ( Razz )
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1860
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, I might have to admit it, I might be getting swayed into believing in Global Warming, this last story has to be proof positive, so now I'm scared.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Santa Warns In Greenpeace Video Christmas Will Be Canceled Due To Global Warming

December 10, 2013 12:27 PM

WASHINGTON (CBS DC) — Greenpeace is warning children the world over Santa Claus might not be bringing gifts to them because of global warming.

A “Save the Arctic” video released by the environmental group shows a sullen and dirty Santa – played by Jim Carter of “Downton Abbey” — in a dark, concrete room with water dripping from the ceiling.

“Dear children, I regrettably bring bad tidings. For some time now, melting ice here in the North Pole has made our operations and our day-to-day life intolerable and impossible and there may be no alternative but to cancel Christmas,” Santa warned in the Greenpeace video.

Santa claims he has written world leaders, including Presidents Barack Obama and Vladimir Putin, but to no avail.

“Sadly my letters have been met with indifference,” Santa says, as lights begin to flicker in the room like a horror movie. “Needless to say these individuals are now at the top of my naughty list.”

In the end, Santa urges those watching to sign a petition to “Save Santa’s Home.”

“My home in the Arctic is fast disappearing and unless we all act urgently then I have to warn you of the possibility of an empty stocking forevermore. Please help me.”

The petition claims global warming is causing the North Pole to melt away faster and faster. The petition also warns of oil companies trying to drill in the Arctic.

“World leaders are ignoring the reindeer’s cries for help as they sink in the melting ice,” the petition states. “Even the threat of being on Santa’s naughty list hasn’t prompted a rescue operation.”

If Santa was living in the South Pole along with Mrs. Claus and his reindeers, though, they would need to bundle up.

NASA satellite data showed that Earth set a new record for coldest temperature recorded when in August 2010, East Antarctica was 135.8 degrees Fahrenheit below zero

For that scary vid, click if you dare~
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/12/10/santa-warns-in-greenpeace-video-christmas-will-be-canceled-due-to-global-warming/

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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1392

PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, and it isn't really a joke.

Our children were subject to what amounted to brain washing for several years, about the wildly exaggerated (previous claims) horrors of global warming. Many parents became incensed at the one sided nature of it all, with no dissent allowed, or tolerated. (B.B.C. management policy, and schooling also.)

It became counter productive in that it gave rise to a large degree of scepticism in many parents, who corrected their own children. They in turn saw with their own eyes that nature had a mind of its own. (The classic, children will no longer know what snow is, howler, which backfired so spectacularly!)

I am not arguing for or against warming here, but insisting that one sided propaganda, with suppression of dissent and counter argument (as happened in many schools) is unacceptable.

Fortunately, the weather doesn't obey the rules, and children notice such things.
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