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PROOF: Obama IS the end of the free world
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2407

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:

What company, pray tell, has ever paid any taxes (that weren't, by definition, ultimately passed on to the consumer)?
What an obvious observation! Thats how it works, pal. Do your homework!
_________________
/w\
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3518

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anybody here own a store except me?
When my taxes go up I can't just add the cost onto my products. I already set my prices at the level I think they will sell. If they can sell for more I will raise my price to the level the market will bear.
Additional taxes?
Landlord raise my rent?
Those events are unfortunate but do not result in a willingness on you guys part to pay me more for gear. I have to find a way to improve sales or reduce overhead, or accept less profit.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1518

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From: http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Californias-Population-Moving-Out-182914961.html

Quote:
About 100,000 more people moved away from California in 2011 than relocated to the Golden State, according to the latest report from the U.S. Census Bureau.

The trend can be explained, in part, in monetary terms. Even in an economic boom, the cost of living in California has increased, prompting people to move out, and, in recent years, unemployment in the state has skyrocketed.

So, where are these former Californians going?

The Census Bureau calculates that the most popular destination is Texas (58,992), a state that is luring California companies. Thatís followed by Arizona (49,635), Nevada (40,114), Washington (38,421) and Oregon (34,214).

Although in smaller numbers, people are still relocating to the Golden State.

Texans make up the largest number of translates to California with 37,387 people, according to the report. That is followed by people from Washington (36,481), Nevada (36,159), Arizona (35,650), and New York (25,269).

Economic experts are optimistic that Californiaís economy has started picking up steam, and may reverse the movement out of the state.

However, this optimism may be short lived with the new state income tax.

keycocker,

I don't own a store, but it would seem logical that for any retail business, when costs go up, you try to pass on those costs to the consumer if you can. Now, if the consumer goes elsewhere because of better prices, then you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Choices may include reducing the selling price to maintain cash flow, but lose money because of smaller profit margin = cut inventory, cut staff, cut staff benefits, move to a lower rent facility, pay yourself less, etc. Bottom line is that higher taxes will either come out of the buyer's pocket, your employee's pocket or your pocket. Somebody WILL take the hit.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14454

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup ... but as long as 51% of the voters (falsely) believe they're all benefiting from the program, they'll keep voting for it.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2735

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
Yup ... but as long as 51% of the voters (falsely) believe they're all benefiting from the program, they'll keep voting for it.

A one-liner response from the very guy who insults others for one-liner responses.

What a surprise. What a hypocrite.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4304

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm now convinced that Isobars is really Walter Brennan.

Keycocker, eventually as more taxes and regulations are piled on, your competetors will go out of business. Prices have to go up as your expenses go up. It might take 3 years, but it will happen.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3694
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
I'm now convinced that Isobars is really Walter Brennan.

Keycocker, eventually as more taxes and regulations are piled on, your competetors will go out of business. Prices have to go up as your expenses go up. It might take 3 years, but it will happen.

And eventually we will become a Walmart nation...oh wait, we ALREADY are!!!
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14454

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
I'm now convinced that Isobars is really Walter Brennan.

Keycocker, eventually as more taxes and regulations are piled on, your competetors will go out of business. Prices have to go up as your expenses go up. It might take 3 years, but it will happen.

I don't get the Brennan connection ... I don't even limp ... but surely KC realizes that his cost of doing business is going up, his profit is a function of sales minus cost of doing business, when that difference = zero his business starts eating his life's savings, and when potential buyers of his business learn that its P/E ratio is infinite [or undefined (0/0) if not publicly held] its blue sky value also goes to zero.


Last edited by isobars on Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2735

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
... but surely KC realizes that his cost of doing business is going up, his profit is a function of sales minus cost of doing business, when that difference = zero his business starts eating his life's savings, and when potential buyers of his business learn that its P/E ratio is zero its blue sky value also goes to zero.

No, Mikey, no.

When he has zero profit, then he's operating like a NON-PROFIT, many of which continue on year after year. He's still employing and paying people, including himself; paying vendors and suppliers; paying rent, telephone, and utilities; paying payroll taxes; and receiving payment for goods/services sold.

But because he nets zero, his business income taxes are zero. He is not necessarily eating into his savings. He can boost his apparent net revenue a number of ways, if he wants to sell the business. But when costs equal to gross revenue, the value of the business does NOT go to zero -- many people buy businesses during depressed times (Mitt Romney, for example).

In your typical fashion, you paint a horribly distorted and intentionally deceptive picture of things.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3518

PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

puenos analysis is consistent with the real world in my store.
I have no competition and often have years in a row with no profit.
This is true of most businesses on the island.Our prices don't go up at the same time as other stores. The nearest one is far away.
My prices can only rise if my clients are willing to pay more like special orders, or certain overbearing dickheads who everyone charges more-the so called gringo tax. Think-ISO
The store still stays open for years without profit, these sailors need these jobs and spend their paychecks in the store when they can.
Their friends are my clients. Laying guys off is bad marketing.
Bard and Techno analysis is correct in a textbook. I hear it on TV.
Store owners can tell you that economic theories grow muddy at the cash register.
I hire more guys when there are more buyers, not when they change the tax code. Send me more clients and raise my taxes 5% and I will be very happy.
Lower my taxes 5% while there is nobody buying and I wont care about taxes and fold up for the season.
REAL WORLD ECONOMICS 101
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