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Windsurfing vehicle, Mini Van ,SUV,Honda Element or box van
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sergem



Joined: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 398

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

human_catapult wrote:
Ever seen the ford flex concept? Looks like it might work...


Looks interesting.

There is one major difference between a dual-purpose vehicle (sport+life) and a single-purpose cargo van (sport) - 1) you don't have to get you gear in and out of your cargo van 2) _All_ of your gear is with you on a session.
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carl



Joined: 25 Feb 1997
Posts: 2674
Location: SF bay area

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
All this talk about Granny and fuel mileage and comfort ... Doesn't anyone ENJOY driving any more? Yeah, I know, it's rough on the pocketbook as fines creep ever higher, but doesn't a vehicle's fun factor count any more? Does everyone live and sail in big cities or suburban sprawls where crowds take the fun out of driving, or has the whole next generation just rolled over and cried "Uncle"?

\m/


It's always a compromise Mike. The perfect fun-to-drive sports car vehicle that carries all our stuff and can also transform to other personal needs, like also carrying people/families with leather seats, just doesn't exist. I have thought about turbocharging the minivan though. For some reason (non-w.s.ers) laugh and say why the heck would anybody put a turbo on a minivan? (Calif CARB laws prohibit that mod anyway).
Obviously the MFGs have the same attitude, concidering the
lack of performance vehicles that actually can carry lots of stuff.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20936

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was speaking more about the driver than the vehicle. All this talk of driving slowly, Priuses (my neighbor's first-gen Prius can't maintain the 40 mph speed limit on the hill we live on), Granny, etc. sounds awfully laid back. Man, when it's windy and I'm not "there" yet, fuel mileage is the last thing on my mind. You know what they say: getting there is half the fun. Heck, my old original Astro van got me from Albuquerque to Hood River in 19 hours with ease, and half of that is two-lane blacktop. Even my motor home is fun to drive on twisty two-lane blacktops when my priority switches from fuel consumption and cops and deer to the OEM speed governor and maximizing my shred time. You guys are sweatin' the difference between 30 and 40 mpg while I'm down in the single-digit range. Oh, that I had such things to sweat. Wink
But I bought it @ closer to a buck a gallon and ain't going to dump it now. ;-(

Make sure whatever you buy is comfortable and suitable for all your priorities in the long haul, so those cross-country trips will be remembered as GOOD times, not hard work. Once you buy and modify a gear-hauling vehicle, the idea of changing vehicles and starting over is a real turnoff. I built my first SERIOUS conversion knowing full well I may have to change a few engines and transmissions before I had to build another one. And, for me, that was a good decision.

\m/
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carl



Joined: 25 Feb 1997
Posts: 2674
Location: SF bay area

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
I was speaking more about the driver than the vehicle. All this talk of driving slowly, Priuses (my neighbor's first-gen Prius can't maintain the 40 mph speed limit on the hill we live on), Granny, etc. sounds awfully laid back. Man, when it's windy and I'm not "there" yet, fuel mileage is the last thing on my mind. You know what they say: getting there is half the fun. Heck, my old original Astro van got me from Albuquerque to Hood River in 19 hours with ease, and half of that is two-lane blacktop. Even my motor home is fun to drive on twisty two-lane blacktops when my priority switches from fuel consumption and cops and deer to the OEM speed governor and maximizing my shred time. You guys are sweatin' the difference between 30 and 40 mpg while I'm down in the single-digit range. Oh, that I had such things to sweat. Wink
But I bought it @ closer to a buck a gallon and ain't going to dump it now. ;-(

Make sure whatever you buy is comfortable and suitable for all your priorities in the long haul, so those cross-country trips will be remembered as GOOD times, not hard work. Once you buy and modify a gear-hauling vehicle, the idea of changing vehicles and starting over is a real turnoff. I built my first SERIOUS conversion knowing full well I may have to change a few engines and transmissions before I had to build another one. And, for me, that was a good decision.

\m/


Mike
So you're saying that any vehicle is fun if you drive fast enough???

You DO know that full size vans roll over fairly easy?
Over the speed limit is usually the cause.

Check the govt roll over tests at:
www.safercar.gov
I noticed that 3 stars seems to be their LOWEST rating. I can't find any
2 stars.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20936

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

carl wrote:
So you're saying that any vehicle is fun if you drive fast enough???


Although that certainly helps, it's not necessary. I'm referring more to the attitude one drives with. The vast majority of drivers I see, at least here in the Pacific NW, drive like sheep. They are the most timid, passive, lead-me-by-the-nose drivers I've ever seen. I have come up on >15 of them stacked up behind a moving roadblock such as a piece of farm equipment, with no reason I could discern but their typical fear of the left lane (it was a two-lane highway with a two-mile straightaway, no side roads, and no oncoming traffic). Without even slowing down, I just moved into the left lane, turned on my headlights, and legally and safely drove by every bleating one of them on cruise control, with my right foot hovering over the brake pedal of my motor home. I see the same attitude and general behavior every single time I drive in OR or WA.

I believe driving assertively and self-assuredly and actively, without ever being aggressive or obnoxious, helps one focus on the otherwise boring task of driving. My objective of covering maximum ground with minimal interference with others makes driving fun, and when I'm doing something fun, I'm giving it every speck of attention I can muster. The safety and ease of that is enhanced by a vehicle's handling in case somebody does something stupid, but I've done just fine for 45 years now in some big, cumbersome vehicles.

carl wrote:
You DO know that full size vans roll over fairly easy?
Over the speed limit is usually the cause.


Well, not directly. It's loss of control that's the issue. Speed, by itself, just burns more dead dinosaurs. My big Econoline's 30-inch-high raised top and contents added probably half a ton above the intact OEM roof, but with the proper aftermarket sway bars, tires, and shocks, it never felt top-heavy. Ditto my motor home. Many big van rollovers are due to shifting high-cg loads, usually humans. My bigger concern with full-sized vans is their head-on crashworthiness, but I'm guessing I'd rather be in the van than in the Prius that rams it head-on.

\m/
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 5467
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rebeccagrosso wrote:
13 bikinis, wetsuits, with room to spare!

I see the pink shoes, but no bikinis. 13 ??

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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3598

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the past hiway deaths were not classified by car types.My nephew at GM said that last two years they broke the info down into catagories and the most deaths occurred in SUVs, according to him. He cares because his job is to market SUVs, and he mainly tried to talk about how safe your family would be in his cars.
It was all the rollovers that made them win the deathtrap award, but a large group also died from losing control in evasive situations.
It would be reasonable to guess mMke is good at those driving situations, but maybe some obese guy from Texas bragging on his cell phone about how safe he is in his Hummer...
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 5467
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Measured the Element , behind drivers seat is only 5', 8 ' on passenger side "with" the seat down flat, which now means just 1 seat. Height is ok for 3 or 4 boards, but would have to be very creative to fit them into some rack, and they would take up lots of width. The Odyssey is slightly better on length, behind drivers around 7', same concerns as Element on passenger side, and rack.
Have yet to look at Toyota & Dodge or Chrysler products.

I don't intent to live out of this, or camp extensively, an occasional night rather than a hotel when on the road, so a platform with a matress would do. No plans for a fridge. I do want it to carry 3 or 4 boards that are 8' long, and have a usable passenger seat, not interested in plowing snow or driving on the beach, the MPG difference is not a problem
The mini-vans unfortunate ,DO no more for me on interior room than a older Isuzu Trooper I had.

At this point I'm about just about ready to look only at cargo vans, the General Motors AWD versions look interesting, Fords seem to be the most popular, I don't see this as a daily vehicle or for use for amost anything else, except windsurfing gear.
should be no problem to change the seats for something more comfortable ,
finding a good used one may be a problem, I think most are in commerical use, and may not have the best of care. The majority of posts have been very helpful, so thanks to all Laughing

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carl



Joined: 25 Feb 1997
Posts: 2674
Location: SF bay area

PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tabou~R2 wrote:
The Odyssey is slightly better on length, behind drivers around 7':


I don't think you correctly assessed the Odyssey (I happen to have one)

Two 8'8" (or longer) boards fit perfectly up the middle with the noses sticking BETWEEN the front seats. The boards have to be SIDEWAYS on their rails. You have to fold down the drink tray between the seats. The front passenger doesn't even know they're there because they sit below the seat. You can also have a passenger in the midde bucket.

I have all the rear seats out and fit 3 boards in with the front passenger seat still usuable. the 3rd board goes in diagonal with it's nose on top of the other 2.
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carl



Joined: 25 Feb 1997
Posts: 2674
Location: SF bay area

PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
carl wrote:
So you're saying that any vehicle is fun if you drive fast enough???


Although that certainly helps, it's not necessary. I'm referring more to the attitude one drives with. The vast majority of drivers I see, at least here in the Pacific NW, drive like sheep. They are the most timid, passive, lead-me-by-the-nose drivers I've ever seen. I have come up on >15 of them stacked up behind a moving roadblock such as a piece of farm equipment, with no reason I could discern but their typical fear of the left lane (it was a two-lane highway with a two-mile straightaway, no side roads, and no oncoming traffic). Without even slowing down, I just moved into the left lane, turned on my headlights, and legally and safely drove by every bleating one of them on cruise control, with my right foot hovering over the brake pedal of my motor home. I see the same attitude and general behavior every single time I drive in OR or WA.

I believe driving assertively and self-assuredly and actively, without ever being aggressive or obnoxious, helps one focus on the otherwise boring task of driving. My objective of covering maximum ground with minimal interference with others makes driving fun, and when I'm doing something fun, I'm giving it every speck of attention I can muster. The safety and ease of that is enhanced by a vehicle's handling in case somebody does something stupid, but I've done just fine for 45 years now in some big, cumbersome vehicles.

carl wrote:
You DO know that full size vans roll over fairly easy?
Over the speed limit is usually the cause.


Well, not directly. It's loss of control that's the issue. Speed, by itself, just burns more dead dinosaurs. My big Econoline's 30-inch-high raised top and contents added probably half a ton above the intact OEM roof, but with the proper aftermarket sway bars, tires, and shocks, it never felt top-heavy. Ditto my motor home. Many big van rollovers are due to shifting high-cg loads, usually humans. My bigger concern with full-sized vans is their head-on crashworthiness, but I'm guessing I'd rather be in the van than in the Prius that rams it head-on.

\m/


We definatly have different ideas of driving fun.

Nobody wants loss of control, it just happens, but too much speed sure makes it happen quicker. I would also rather have a vehicle that is less prone to roll.
I saw a newer Mercedes SUV roll about 4 times on to the center divider of the 280 freeway last winter. It was raining heavy, probably going too fast, talkin on the cell and hydroplaned. Definatly scarry. It convinced me that a SUV or high center vehicle was not the way to go.
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