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Feeling ill . . . Someone Might Listen
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Stacey Wenger



Joined: 21 Jun 2001
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:31 pm    Post subject: Feeling ill . . . Someone Might Listen Reply with quote

Two weeks ago JesusJones started a thread called “Feeling ill from the water” http://forums.iwindsurf.com/viewtopic.php?t=12553&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. Because of all the disturbing comments of symptoms that matched my own and alohannie’s description of the “Brawny paper mill/plant in Clatskenie spewing out Black Liquor” drove me to write an email to the following:
crk@columbiariverkeeper.org
brentfoster@gorge.net - Director Columbia Riverkeeper
philip.jeff@epa.gov
Chun.Eva@epamail.epa.gov - Office of Compliance and Enforcement
bussell.mike@epamail.epa.gov
BILLINGS.Jim@deq.state.or.us - Oregon Department of Environmental Quality-water quality
leszaitz@news.oregonian.com
TraceyL@katu.com - KATU Special Projects Producer

Many of them have responded. (Surprise, I expected to hear chirping crickets) We have been asked using this forum to answer to a questionnaire:

1. sailing/swimming location
2. time of year
3. type of symptoms and their duration
4. Average number of times people are in the water a month
5. average duration of time in the water total
6. typical number of times people actually swim and dunk their heads in a month (lol) Laughing
7. do you get these symptoms if you windsurf or kite at other places?
8. contact info (name, email, address and phone #.) if you feel uncomfortable, email this this info to the email list above.
9. additional comments/information:

Please try and all questions in order and be complete. I will make sure the people listed above are watching this thread. Our job is to supply the info if you truly want to be heard…

Thanks and pass the Sudafed
Jeff
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14322

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Feeling ill . . . Someone Might Listen Reply with quote

Stacey Wenger wrote:


1. sailing/swimming location
2. time of year
3. type of symptoms and their duration
4. Average number of times people are in the water a month
5. average duration of time in the water total
6. typical number of times people actually swim and dunk their heads in a month (lol) Laughing
7. do you get these symptoms if you windsurf or kite at other places?
8. contact info (name, email, address and phone #.) if you feel uncomfortable, email this this info to the email list above.
9. additional comments/information:


1. The Columbia River, from Wallula Gap to Clatskenie.
2. April through November.
3. Chronic sinus infection, visible on MRI, with sinus pressure behind the cheekbones, endless post-nasal drip, gummy eye discharge (only west of Longview), months of productive coughing. It will gradually subside over the winter (I live in SE Washington), then return when I begin sailing again. The farther west I sail, the quicker the onset of symptoms; at Jones Beach severe symptoms occur within one day or sailing.
4. ON the river 15-20 days in a windy month.
5. ON the river 100-200 hours in a good month
6. IN the river a thousand times a month for a total of, say, a thousand minutes, often very forceful faceplants. (It's only *WATER*, guys; that's why we quit riding dirt bikes.)
7. Clatskenie is in a class by itself, but in general it's *obvious* that the further west I sail, the faster my sunglasses film over and the faster my head clogs up.
8. In the e-mail.
9. It beats the carnage of dirt biking.

\m/
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madspaniard



Joined: 23 May 2005
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aren't you worried they might use this info to ban swimming/sailing in the river for safety reasons? just a question.
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alohannie



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeff,
Are you the email address at epa.gov?
thanks, ann
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jesusjones



Joined: 17 May 2001
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I forgot to mention that I also acquired shingles, which is usually something old people get. The doctor couldn’t believe I had at 37. Did all the sailing and water bugs run my immune system down? Sad Even today, three years later I still itch and have scaring from that deal.
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jesusjones



Joined: 17 May 2001
Posts: 229

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Embarassed 1. Sailing/swimming location: Rooster Rock, and 100 miles east of The Dalles.
2. Time of year: April Through October
3. Type of symptoms and their duration: Unbeliably clogged up nose, itchy ears. Bad fatigue for at least three days.
4. Average number of times people are in the water a month: 9
5. Average duration of time in the water total: 2 and ½ hours
6. Typical number of times people actually swim and dunk their heads in a month (lol) : 300
7. Do you get these symptoms if you windsurf or kite at other places? Yes
8. Contact info (name, email, address and phone #.) if you feel uncomfortable, email this info to the email list above. Todd, todd@goarinc.com. Vancouver Washington. 503-382-9612
9. Additional comments/information: Did the river give me shingles? Ok let’s hear all the smart ass’s out there.
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pacspeed



Joined: 14 Sep 2000
Posts: 612

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sure all this info will be collated and presented into a very effective press release stating that :

"There is no conclusive evidence that the black liquor from the Clatskanie paper mill plant has any correlation to the symptoms described above. The Brawny paper products company is fully committed to the health of our natural environment. Buy Brawny paper towels."
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Stacey Wenger



Joined: 21 Jun 2001
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alohannie wrote:
Jeff,
Are you the email address at epa.gov?
thanks, ann

ann,
no, I'm just a another drippy nose'd sailor. I received a call from Eva Chun, epa, and she is very interested in hearing your story. Feel free to call her at 206-553-1970. you can call me at 541-490-6067 if you want more info. Jeff C
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Stacey Wenger



Joined: 21 Jun 2001
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Feeling ill . . . Someone Might Listen Reply with quote

all good comments BUT, the riverkeepers, epa and deq are more interested in the answers to the questions. Here's my response;

1. kite and windsurf from stevenson to maryhill
2. april thru oct.
3. uncontrolable sneezing attacks, total sinus meltdown, blocked ears, fatique, I've had sinus and ear infection. Clears up after 2 days out of the water.
4. in water 8 times/month
5. 2-5 hours/session
6. 40 head dunks/hr. That's on a good day. A dunking can last 1/2sec. to until you cry uncle. The question should be the velocity of the nasal injection...
7. No. Only the columbia
8. 541-490-6067 jeffreycas@yahoo.com
Stacey Wenger wrote:
Two weeks ago JesusJones started a thread called “Feeling ill from the water” http://forums.iwindsurf.com/viewtopic.php?t=12553&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0. Because of all the disturbing comments of symptoms that matched my own and alohannie’s description of the “Brawny paper mill/plant in Clatskenie spewing out Black Liquor” drove me to write an email to the following:
crk@columbiariverkeeper.org
brentfoster@gorge.net - Director Columbia Riverkeeper
philip.jeff@epa.gov
Chun.Eva@epamail.epa.gov - Office of Compliance and Enforcement
bussell.mike@epamail.epa.gov
BILLINGS.Jim@deq.state.or.us - Oregon Department of Environmental Quality-water quality
leszaitz@news.oregonian.com
TraceyL@katu.com - KATU Special Projects Producer

Many of them have responded. (Surprise, I expected to hear chirping crickets) We have been asked using this forum to answer to a questionnaire:

1. sailing/swimming location
2. time of year
3. type of symptoms and their duration
4. Average number of times people are in the water a month
5. average duration of time in the water total
6. typical number of times people actually swim and dunk their heads in a month (lol) Laughing
7. do you get these symptoms if you windsurf or kite at other places?
8. contact info (name, email, address and phone #.) if you feel uncomfortable, email this this info to the email list above.
9. additional comments/information:

Please try and all questions in order and be complete. I will make sure the people listed above are watching this thread. Our job is to supply the info if you truly want to be heard…

Thanks and pass the Sudafed
Jeff
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ledel



Joined: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since I have worked in Environmenal Law and Compliance for many years and am a windsurfer who sails on the Columbia ( I do use a nose plug due to a tendency to sinus infection) I am interested in this topic. But frankly, anecdotal evidence of this sort isn't of much value other than perhaps to raise awareness. What is obviously needed is some regular Summer time water quality monitoring for bacteria and select toxics, at least at more populous windsurfing beaches /areas such as the Event Site and Hatch. That type of monitoring was being done at the Coast under an EPA grant. My understanding, subject to correction, is that it isn't presently done on a regular basis on the Columbia., notwithstanding that both EPA and DEQ know there is significant human contact with the water at some of these beaches. I think if CGWA requested monitoring, the agencies might be able find some funding to do it . Then we would have some basis upon which to decide whether collective or individual precautions are warranted .
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