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Foiling Upwind - any tips?
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brynkaufman2



Joined: 10 Sep 2002
Posts: 378
Location: Kailua Oahu

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:50 am    Post subject: Foiling Upwind - any tips? Reply with quote

Any tips on rigging for foiling more up wind?

Today on my Naish 142 foil board paired with the Flyer 6.0 foil sail and Naish WS foil with 90 cm mast I felt upwind challenged.

I was going for almost 3 hours and could get the foil up fairly easy so I felt there was enough wind, but when I tried to get the upwind angle I wanted I could not keep my speed so I had to point more down the wind otherwise I would drop to the water.

I believe flattening out the sail might help, and I have a new boom coming in to run the 6.0 sail on where I can use an adjustable outhaul, so flattening it out might help.

I am planning on moving my foot straps which are currently in the middle position back, as I noticed when I put my foot behind my rear strap my lift off was much sooner than when in my strap. Perhaps that will help as I can stay in the air at a slower speed while pointing more upwind.

In the current position my rear foot is directly over the mast on the foil.

The mast for my sail is positioned towards the back of the board as far as it will go.

My boom height was higher than normal, about chin height. Normally I run a bit lower but I wanted to see if I could get more power by raising it up a bit.

I noticed running with my adjustable harness lines shorter seemed to give me more upwind ability, although they became so short it was difficult to get my seat harness into them when the wind was light before I got going.

Any tips would be welcome.

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Bryn Kaufman
Wind Foiling Kailua Bay since June 2017
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2623

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shorter lines for sure as you will be oversheeting the sail past the centerline. I push down through the front heel & push out with the front hand while the back foot pushes laterally against the foil. The wing of the sail will be pulling you up & you counter by trying to drive the nose down. When I first turn upwind it feels like I can go straight into the wind but then the pressure dies so I have to bear off a bit and trim from there. It feels kind of like a slingshot when you first turn up wind.

I think an AO is a great idea. I have AO on my race booms but have not been using sails large enough to bother with the AO.

Board setup will very with different boards. I have the Naish Hover 122 & run my track back but people with formula boards are running track forward. I'm not sure footstrap position will help with upwind, I think it is more about balancing on the foil. I have not played with foil mast movement for upwind downwind yet, only for balancing foot pressure but you could try playing with that. Right now I do not see why moving the foil forward or backward would help going upwind but it may.

Coachg
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brynkaufman2



Joined: 10 Sep 2002
Posts: 378
Location: Kailua Oahu

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coachg, you have the same board but smaller and you have no problem heading up wind?

Do you have the straps in the back and do you have the foil centered or placed forward or back from the center?

It sounds like you might have more lift because if I push down on my front heel a lot it will bring the board down. I still feel more back foot weighted.

Do you lean out when going up wind? Are you using the harness and do you have most of the sail pull in the harness or in your arms when going upwind?

I do understand what you are saying about feeling like a slingshot heading into the wind. I can do that, and I actually used that technique one day to get back as it seemed to get me more upwind than just going straight.

The ease of take off on this board is great, so I am hoping to solve this upwind issue as that is my biggest problem right now.

I rode in really light wind today with my foot straps all the way back. It made it much easier to take off, but I still felt like I had to use a lot of leaning and arm muscle to get upwind at all.

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Bryn Kaufman
Wind Foiling Kailua Bay since June 2017
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2623

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bryn,
Back footstrap all the way back, front one hole up from the back. Foil mast 2 cm behind the mid mark. I lean out & forward to go up wind. I usually use my harness to go up wind.

Coachg
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brynkaufman2



Joined: 10 Sep 2002
Posts: 378
Location: Kailua Oahu

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Coachg.
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Bryn Kaufman
Wind Foiling Kailua Bay since June 2017
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 569

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me I use a slight sheet out to roll the board to windward then apply enough weight through the harness to keep it from rounding up. Once I'm balanced most of my drive is through my front heel with a little pull upward from those toes, the rear foot trims.
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brynkaufman2



Joined: 10 Sep 2002
Posts: 378
Location: Kailua Oahu

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Grant, rolling the board windward is my challenge.

With my JP 155 it was a lot easier to roll it windward. I could get out on the rails of that very wide board and roll it.

With the Naish board my feet are really centered close to the foil, so rolling the board is not easy.

On the JP 155 I would put my foot in the middle when I wanted to go downwind, and move it out to the back strap to roll it to go upwind. On the Naish my foot is essentially always close to the middle, so I feel like I am always in a downwind position.

Maybe I just need more experience to roll a more narrow board windward, not sure.

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Bryn Kaufman
Wind Foiling Kailua Bay since June 2017
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2623

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bryn,
Board like the JP or Fanatic Gecko are much easier to take upwind because they are wider but you can do it on the Naish. My front knee is bent and back leg fully straight as I swing forward & outward to go upwind. Do this without the harness at first until you get a feel for the position & then adjust your harness line length to match.

I ended up taking the adjustable lines off my race boom & put them on one of my wave booms for foiling since you can point so high & so deep with foiling.

Coachg
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brynkaufman2



Joined: 10 Sep 2002
Posts: 378
Location: Kailua Oahu

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Coachg, I will practice that.

I did notice I could do it somewhat, but I could not seem to find a comfortable position where the pull from the sail was on the harness line and not on my arms.

I will keep trying to tweak my harness lines to find the right angle. I think I have to shorten my lines even more and get used to riding upwind like that.

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Bryn Kaufman
Wind Foiling Kailua Bay since June 2017
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 569

PostPosted: Thu Aug 16, 2018 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm on a narrow (74cm) board using long (30") lines in mostly very light wind with large (5.5-7.2) sails. I use a rearward mast base and fairly low boom specifically to reduce MBP and keep weight on my feet.
As an exercise (or for fun) I'd recommend carving turns as far upwind and as deep downwind as tight as possible. That gained my huge benefits towards understanding how rig control changes foil trim.
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