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Formula boards in waves and chop?
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 712

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not much wind and a rough ocean, not a good combination. Formula is an all or nothing deal, planing with an appropriately sized giant sail and fin or schlogging.
That would be a pretty bad deal schlogging in a rough ocean on a Formula board and trying to get in and out thru the surf.
You are however about the size of pro Formula sailors, perhaps a bit heavier. They use their size leverage and to hold down those giant sails and strength pump them like an orangutang.
In that kind of wind you will be doing a lot of non-planing windsurfing, a narrower long board would give you the floatation you need for your size and superior glide during non-planing. Could also be used in the surf with smaller more manageable sails and not be concerned with planing, just getting in and out and playing in the waves.
I have a 8M Superfreak, it's my most used sail. Is yours an ultra light? made from kite material? They can be bagged out all the way to 499 downhaul and 212 outhaul for power in very light wind. You can also use a 460 mast if that's all you have.
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gregnw44



Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 246

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bamer wrote:

But having that said: do you want to own/ sail 10-12 meter sails? Does your beach allow you to clear a 70cm fin and get a waterstart off without getting rolled by shorebreak (as bred2shred noted)?

A wide slalom setup could be an option with a board around 80-85cm wide and a ~9.5 meter rig. But realistically at 240 lbs that isn't going to get going in 8-10mph. For the sail you could get something like a Retro which will have much more power than a race sail, but will still be plenty fast. With this setup the fin would be closer to 50cm.

.


Bamer (and other's with info about this)... sorry for a slight thread hi-jack -

But, WHY would a RAF sail like a Retro (which I own and like, BTW) have more power than a race sail ???
MUCH more power, you're saying?

I don't get this at all.
From my perspective... they might be similar when well powered-up, in steady wind... sure.
But... when there are lulls (always happens)... the cambered race sail would maintain power longer and regain power sooner.
And... when exiting a jibe... a race sail would gain speed quicker.
And, if there were big gusts... a cambered sail will maintain stability better.

Anyway, that's my perspective. What am I missing? I have never thought that a sail like a Retro would have "more power" than a race sail.
Greg Smile
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14337

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A race sail's forte is low drag, not high power. Meter for meter, they generally have less power. The first "race sail" our magazine tested in the Gorge, from Neil Pryde, came with written instructions to rig about 16% bigger than we'd normally rig. I'm sure someone will correct me if that trend has reversed since then. Flat = low drag, draft = power, generally speaking.

Last edited by isobars on Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gobigkahuna



Joined: 11 Mar 2004
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy wrote:
I have a 8M Superfreak, it's my most used sail. Is yours an ultra light? made from kite material? They can be bagged out all the way to 499 downhaul and 212 outhaul for power in very light wind. You can also use a 460 mast if that's all you have.


It's the ultra light version. Feels like nylon ripstop with a vinyl window. It has one small rip that the previous owner taped, but I will do a more professional repair before using it. I heard a lot of good things about the superfreak so I bought it. I'm hoping it becomes my most used sail also.

Ok, I think I'm pretty much over getting a formula board. The locals all insisted it's the only way to go. I'll stick to my big SUP + superfreak for now and see how it goes. That AHD looks sweet, a fish with a mast track, love it. That'll be on my short list when I'm ready...
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2413

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any high volume (150+ board) used with an appropriate sized powered up sail can work just fine. Key is correct power to fly the fin, so the rest of the board glides thru the air over the chop.
Formula can work well with any long boom sail bigger than 5.7, for planing conditions.
Best call out in the ocean is a freeride board that is stronger and heavier, using a swept back BIG fin to glide over kelp beds and allow decent upwind performance.
And SUP/windsurf combo can work, but you're giving up a lot in early planing, jibing, jumping, and performance.
A longboard of 250 liters would also work, but their masttrack's aren't safe nor reliable.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 712

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes the ripstop dacron with the little squares is the ultra-light version superfreak.
If the wind picks up a bit and the sail starts to tug at left and right hands becoming unstable just tighten the DH and OH a bit together towards the recommended setting otherwise for max power in low wind 499-212. Play around with it, some people may find that setting too unstable.
To make a permanent repair just use tear-aid type A tape, like this; http://www.sailrite.com/Tear-Aid-Repair-Kit-Type-A
It will be permanent enough unless the tear is near a seam.
Cut the corners round so it won't snag and pull off, apply to both sides if you want.
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gobigkahuna



Joined: 11 Mar 2004
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The last owner used a huge patch of that "tear-aid" stuff and it looks nasty. I stopped by my favorite sailmaker and got some matching color sail repair tape. I'll tape that up on both sides and it should hold. I might even stitch it (I have access to a sailmaker's sewing machine) if I get a chance.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14337

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zirtaeb wrote:
And SUP/windsurf combo can work, but you're giving up a lot in early planing, jibing, jumping, and performance.

Jibing? A SeaLion turns on a small dime, wind or no wind, planing or pivoting.
It planes very early considering its wave performance.
It jumps VERY well. The problem is that it and its rider then land in different places. Smile
Define "performance". Did you watch any of the videos?
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2413

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Compare planing performance between your SeaLion and a 135 liter slalom board, please.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14337

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zirtaeb wrote:
Compare planing performance between your SeaLion and a 135 liter slalom board, please.

I did. "It planes very early considering its wave performance.".
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