myiW Current Conditions and Forecasts Community Forums Windsurfing Videos Buy and Sell Services
 
Hi guest · myAccount · Log in
 SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RegisterRegister 
Roosevelt Park water/bathroom shut down for at least 2014

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Northwest USA & Canada
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14476

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 11:45 am    Post subject: Roosevelt Park water/bathroom shut down for at least 2014 Reply with quote

I just confirmed this with the head Corps of Engineers ranger for the The Dalles district: purely due to funding shortfall, the Corps will shut off Roosevelts's potable water system next week for at least the rest of the year. That means no bathrooms, showers, or potable water ... merely sprinkler system and porta potties for at least this whole season, with the distinct possibility of further cutbacks next year. (Don't forget that if the Corps ultimately has to abandon Roosevelt, it reverts by law/treaty to the Yakama Nation permanently, at which point we lose access to it forever.)

The Corps informed all relevant organizations last week, and have not received even one complaint yet. The CGWA got their letter Thursday and is looking into it today, but Ranger Tony says a letter campaign will not help this year, that's it's set in stone. It MAY provide them with some justification for increased budget requests for 2015 or 2016, but the real obstacle is that federal administration funding for recreation in general is trickling down. (Our only collective hope, and it's a long shot, is simple: vote accordingly this fall and in two years.)

Roosevelt is the third most-heavily used park in this Corps district. If it's going down, this may be just the beginning. When I get around to it (there's no hurry) I'll post addresses in Portland and in Washington, DC to which we can complain.

I told Tony that many of us would write the Corps a substantial check if it would help, but the Corps and the federal government just aren't set up to work that way (no surprise there). Fees? That means hiring a fee collector when their work force is being slashed.

Mike \m/ Sad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
brettn



Joined: 22 Nov 2000
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the research. Keep us posted. That would be a tough loss.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
anecak



Joined: 30 Jun 2003
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike, what is the basis on which the park would revert to the Yakama Nation if the Corps decides to abandon it? I don't think it is the law that any property abandoned by any property owner along the river automatically reverts to the tribes. Beyond that, we should consider trying to stay aware of what the Corps decides to do and steer them toward deeding it specifically to Washington Parks, Klickitat County, or someone else, as opposed to abandoning it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14476

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Corps has no say in the matter. The Yakama Nation's ancestral roots are offshore of the park, and they have total legal claim to it if the Corps relinquishes ownership (as the state did before the Corps picked it up as the final step in public custody). I've posted the legal term before, but forget it now (I think it was subrogation. and it gives the Yakamas first rights after the Corps). I also don't recall whether it's a court decision, a treaty clause, or both, but it is inviolable.

That's one of the reasons we don't want to push the Corps as hard as some scofflaws are prone to doing. Some day one more loose dog, or one more noisy camper late at night, or one more kid digging in the sand at the water's edge (the surface must not be broken), or one more squabble over saving a parking place or hogging two or three, or one more park user modifying the plumbing, or one more sailor deliberately ramming another at high speed, or one more complaint because some camp host informed a park user about these rules (actually federal laws), and the Corps can just throw up their hands in defeat and frustration and decide they're done with it. Policing those actions is now up to park users, since a small group of activist rule-breakers persuaded the Corps to fire the best host the park has seen in the 22 years I've been sailing there and no new hosts are volunteering.

The Yakama do not want us there, and the minute they take possession is the minute the best venue on the Columbia becomes off limits to us.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
anecak



Joined: 30 Jun 2003
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't think that's how it works. Basically, the State of Washington, in a treaty around 1855 or so, appropriated all the Yakama's territory in Washington in exchange for the reservation lands, and provided that the Yakamas retained forever the right to fish for salmon in all their usual and customary places and quantities. So, the land was surrendered and became non-Indian land except where reservations were established. A federal court decision several years affirmed that the states can't limit the fishing conducted by the tribes, which is why the in-lieu fishing sites have been established by the Corps up and down the river. Nevertheless, land that has not been retained in ownership by the tribes after the 1855 treaty is land that is owned by whatever parties own it. It would not revert to the tribe because the Corps of Engineers decides not to own it any more and the Corps should be able to deed it to another owner just like any other real estate. Unless the Roosevelt park as a whole was created by some separate agreement between the Corps and the tribe that expressly says it reverts, I doubt that is what would happen. That being said, it is still a good idea to be vigilant about what the Corps is planning to do with the land.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14476

PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My sources for reversion to the Yakama Nation include Corps lawyers and a local fed, both of whose careers are all about Native American treaties. Their claims address specifically Roosevelt and the Yakama Nation.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
GuyT



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 152

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that's a terrible news, confirmed here:

http://www.nwp.usace.army.mil/Media/NewsReleases/tabid/1888/Article/22932/corps-of-engineers-limits-services-at-john-day-dams-roosevelt-park.aspx

Roosevelt is by far my favorite place in The Gorge. It would be awful if we eventually loss all access to the park.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
anthwind



Joined: 22 Apr 2001
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike is correct, the park would most likely revert back to the tribe. I work in the Columbia Gorge area as an engineer, so I know this.

Anthony
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14476

PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

anthwind wrote:
Mike is correct ...

Fancy that; the odds of that are roughly 19,994 out of 20,000. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Northwest USA & Canada All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum

myiW | Weather | Community | Membership | Support | Log in
like us on facebook
© Copyright 1999-2007 WeatherFlow, Inc Contact Us Ad Marketplace

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group