myiW Current Conditions and Forecasts Community Forums Windsurfing Videos Buy and Sell Services
 
Hi guest · myAccount · Log in
 SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   RegisterRegister 
iWindsurf removing criticism of Isobars. Really
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Windsurfing Discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14184

PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
My only issue on these forums is with the derogatory and demeaning personal comments that several of the posters here feel compelled to write.


The baseless crap these people are going on about was typical of them. "Iso lies, Iso attacks people, and on and on and on" ... the usual "lyingracisthomophobicpedophiledenier" stuff straight out of mac land expressly discouraged by that thread's OP, Mitch Gingrich, who is doing an online public interview for Windsport Mag. I can only guess he asked iW to filter the worst of the offenders (but with only limited success, as shown by Puffin's, Chandler's, Werden's, Shuz's, and a few others' false accusations.) Enter at your own peril. I have rehab to attend to.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PeconicPuffin



Joined: 07 Jun 2004
Posts: 1211

PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
I wonder what kind of individual/personality would avoid this forum just because of guys like Iso?


Excellent question. It turns out that the vast majority of people don't want to debate or argue. Discuss, fine, but go up against resistance...the number is something like one person in eight. So about 78 percent of people, statistically.

I am a media professional in real life (laugh if you want!) I know for myself when I first learned that stat and watched it show up in various audience results I was surprised. I like a good debate! But it turns out that most people don't, particularly when it is increasingly argumentative.

The participating audience in iWindsurf's forums is fairly self-selected, and the people who participate obviously like (or don't mind) the environment.

In my own life the people who have told me in as many words that they don't want to get into it because of Iso include some outstanding windsurfers (and fine citizens generally).

I don't disagree that "Iso does make some valid points from time to time." You don't see me in those threads. If you look you can even find my attempting humor by stating that a rare agreement is taking place (I've posted that at least three times).

_________________
Michael
http://www.peconicpuffin.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14184

PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PeconicPuffin wrote:
the vast majority of people don't want to debate or argue. Discuss, fine, but go up against resistance...

Yep ... and those are among the ones doomed to go through life believing that the cumbersome step jibe, gear forced into conditions it wasn't designed for, cammed sails, "cool" sailing styles and boards, living in the doldrums, overbearing jobs, textbook hand- and foot-work, and so many more straightjackets are the only way they are allowed to play ... BECAUSE they look away when someone advances and defends alternatives as I do. I've seen many novices and intermediates quit the sport because they actually BELIEVE there is only one way to play.

I suspect those are few and far between. The far bigger crowd, in any real world I've ever encountered, is people who get fed up with your and others' incessant false ad hominem, followed by my relatively very rare defenses against it. They have several options, including: speak out against it with facts, look away, dig through the pony crap for the pony, demand that iW fulfill their contract to restrict personal attacks, recognize that our rate of progress in this sport depends on paying dues ... both on and off the water.

If people like you would stick to windsurfing issues and leave Mike Fick's parentage and mating habits the hell out of it, this would be a far, far better place to hang out.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DelCarpenter



Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 184
Location: Cedar Falls, IA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know how to bring in quotes from earlier posts. I'm replying to Peconic Puffin's post which said: "I've been sharing the following thread as a crystal clear example of why Iso is in fact harmful to this forum. I invite you to read it and say whether you think this is a pissing match, or one person causing trouble."

I read that thread while it was being written. One person threw out an invitation to trouble and 3 or 4 of the next 4 posts accepted the invitation.

When the invitation is, "Hey, lets me and some of you fight on this forum," should the response be, "Yes"? Even with someone who often throws out that invitation, I think ignoring the invitation is the best response. When the invitation is accepted both posters are fighting. The issue of who started a fight becomes less and less important the longer the fight goes on, because the longer a fight goes on the more chances each fighter has to stop the fight.

When a forum viewer who was not targeted sees what they think is a punch thrown, but the intended target does not respond, the viewer begins to think the punch did not land on the target (no matter how the target feels). A punch ignored on a forum becomes meaningless or makes the punch thrower look silly to non-targeted viewers.

For this response I invented the acronym, WWMYBAD...."what would my better angel do." On a forum, with none of the possible consequences of a real life in-person confrontation, I think our better selves would tell us to ignore the invitation to fight.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5820

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To get to the truth about threads going south, all one needs to do is go to an example like Peconic Puffin highlighted in his 13:41 post. If one is not seeing it in that thread, I know I could undoubtedly offer up another 5 with no problem. Threads where isobars goes off-the-top aren't hard to find.

Sure, it often takes more than one person to mess up a thread, but who's normally at the heart of most of the trouble? It's usually isobars. Just the number of posts per thread clearly reveals that he is not satisfied with just stating his opinion and being done with it. He's a guy always on the move for an argument. He the classic ringer for a guy going to a bar looking for a fight. I think we all know trip wires that can set him off. BFF, folks mowing the lawn at his favorite spots, Portland, Corpus Cristi, kiters, parking at Roosevelt or the Hatchery or even how to jibe. The list goes on and on. I don't know how many times he has whined about is sandwich story at Lopez Lake, and then predictably craps on California.

If you listen to him, he's never at fault. It's always the other guy. He did it above in the post at the top of the page. It's me, mac, peconic puffin or some other troublemaker. But let's be serious, how many times do I get into everyone's face about windsurfing and drag it on and on?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PeconicPuffin



Joined: 07 Jun 2004
Posts: 1211

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
those are among the ones doomed to go through life believing that the cumbersome step jibe, gear forced into conditions it wasn't designed for, cammed sails, "cool" sailing styles and boards, living in the doldrums, overbearing jobs, textbook hand- and foot-work, and so many more straightjackets are the only way they are allowed to play ... BECAUSE they look away when someone advances and defends alternatives as I do. I've seen many novices and intermediates quit the sport because they actually BELIEVE there is only one way to play.


Perfect comment from you.
"Cumbersome step jibe"...something you simultaneously claim to offer tips on (your retyping of Cort Larned 101) yet have never established that you can actually do (or any other jibe).
"Gear forced into conditions it wasn't designed for". Forced? This goes back to your not understanding how good freestyle boards are for freesailing. Also another excellent example of you jumping into a thread in which you admit you have no experience or knowledge, and yet post 10+ times, from ignorance: http://www.iwindsurf.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=26773
"cool sailing styles" as previously discussed, you can't bear a conversation about things you can't do: http://www.iwindsurf.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=23843 (this is the thread I posted days ago, for those following along)
"living in the doldrums" You can't do lightwind freestyle or enjoy big sail windsurfing, and so you dismiss them.
etc.
You don't advance and defend alternatives. You argue for bad habits (BFF etc).

_________________
Michael
http://www.peconicpuffin.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
boardsurfr



Joined: 23 Aug 2001
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like they took isobars of his meds, and he's in a bad mood. Too bad, I thought the messages with a million typos where funny.

The other Michael (PeconicPuffin) has a very good point about the vast majority of people not wanting to debate or argue. I also know quite a few windsurfers who stay away from the forum for this very reason. But I'm not sure why he jumps at every bait that iso posts. I agree with DelCarpenter - think about whether or not you really want this fight before answering. Especially in the next few months while isobars will be largely immobile - except for his typing finger!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14184

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DelCarpenter wrote:
When the invitation is, "Hey, lets me and some of you fight on this forum," ... I think ignoring the invitation is the best response.


Thus my killfile and my very frequent impersonal, topical responses to people who wrap legitimate questions in personal dog crap. I may not have a better angel, but my lesser devil is alive and well.

(People who think rational topical debate of complex topics is "fighting" have my sympathy. The real world must be a very fearful place for you, seriously. I saw a man dying of cancer leave our support forum because he couldn't handle frank medical debates over potential treatment side effects. We hope he made a right decision nevertheless. All we have at stake is jibing, which for many determines whether they abandon the sport.)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3056
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

such a soft heart

from a person who has his own personal enemy list here

think Iam #32

_________________
K4 fins
4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
slinky



Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 419
Location: Old Saybrook Ct.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who in their right mind would want to debate or argue with a person who has been wrong 4 times in 20,000? Not my words his, when asked if he was ever wrong about anything.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    iWindsurf Community Forum Index -> Windsurfing Discussion All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 2 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum

myiW | Weather | Community | Membership | Support | Log in
like us on facebook
© Copyright 1999-2007 WeatherFlow, Inc Contact Us Ad Marketplace

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group