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Sail twist and mast stiffnes
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dechev59@gmail.com



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 9:01 pm    Post subject: Sail twist and mast stiffnes Reply with quote

Hi everyone,
I got a Maui sails MS-2 9.5m that has 534 luff and call for 520 mast, but since I don't have a 520 I'm using it with my 490 30% mast with a longer extension. I know that the mast isn't the best match for the sail, but the cams rotates easy, the profile of the sail looks OK and I can handle it in gusts up to 25mph.
I got a video http://youtu.be/NuI8v4aPG1k of me sailing with that sail in 15mph day with gusts at no more than 20 mph The board is 170 l BIC Nova with 56cm curtis fin /pretty narrow chord/ mast all the way back and me 180lbs.
Can somebody tell me by just watching the video if the top of the sail flaps to much because of the soft/unappropried mast and if a little bigger fin will help to lift the windward rail and ease up the board.
All the help will be appreciated!!!

PS Im not pretty sure the link of the video will apear as a link. Just in case here is the URL for copy and paste http://youtu.be/NuI8v4aPG1k
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damel



Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 1:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea that probably has something to do with the softer shorter mast. The sail doesn't look bad all things considered and it is rigged with a tighter leach than you would if you were full on racing with the specified mast. It is probably better anyways for freeriding as it is more forgiving than a race setup. I have heard of lighter freestyle sailors rigging their biggest sails on 400cm mast instead of 430 to give them a softer feel. Its probably not the end of the world and might be a plus unless you are racing on a slalom course or trying to get a max speed on a GPS.
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adywind



Joined: 08 Jan 2012
Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'm with Damel. The shape looks fine if a bit underdawnhauled, wich you probably do intentionally to compensate for the softer/shorter then recommend mast. 30 % is much less then the recommended 75% as well but hey, you have to work with what you've got right? I can confirm from my own experience that softer mast is an advantage for the upper end of the sail, but it will loose in the lower end. I guess that's why you posted your question , you were somewhat dissapointed from the lower end performance of the sail. It doesn't get you up on a plane as early as expected. If its very important to you and if you are heavy, strong guy you may consider getting the right mast in the future, but if you are not and you like it's extended upper end and the ability to depower easier during the gybe stay with what you have.
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capetonian



Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 896
Location: Oahu

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd agree with the previous posters, nothing wrong with what you're doing.

I used to sail a Maui Sails TR5 9.2 with a 490 100% carbon mast rather than a 520 100% carbon mast (the recommended mast). The sail felt too stiff with the recommended mast, but smooth with the shorter mast. I was 210 lbs back then, so not exactly a lightweight.
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dechev59@gmail.com



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 7:04 pm    Post subject: Sail twist and mast stiffnes Reply with quote

Thank you for the replays.
Looks like my 490 will be OK with the sail. My concern was that the sail feels big and heavy but considering my biggest sail before was 7.2 I guess its normal for the 9.5 to feel heavier and a little flimsy.
Will using a bigger fin will lift the board more, make it feel looser over the chop, without sacrificing the speed?
I have a 138l Starboard F type and when I'm sailing it with the same fin /56cm curtis pointer/ and the 7.2 well powered up the baoard flies over the chop and I can go upwind with pretty much the same speed Im going on a beam reach.
With the Nova which is actually a BIC Techno Formula I can't get this loose feeling, it is always feel sticky and no mater how much I move the mast back or raise the boom the board doesn't want to get loose and fly upwind.
If anybody has the same board pls let me know what size fin works best with 9-10m sail, will 70cm be to much? the board is 94 wide and 170l.
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joethewindsufa



Joined: 10 Oct 2010
Posts: 179
Location: Montréal

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i have a BIC Techno Formula since last year
i use it with a MauiSails TR-4 10-oh and plan to try a TR-6 8.4 this year.
my board is with the trimm box and not that many fins to choose from
i have a 58 cm True Ames SB weed fin, but prefer the Select 66 cm race fin.
with my 95-100 kilos/210-220 lbs, i can plane in 10-12 knots {depending}
i go out when winds are announced around 20 kph ie under 10 knots Smile
my mast is a 520/100 for the 10-oh and 490/75 for the 8.4
as indicated - your leech is tight and yet you feel a lack of power / low end?
i had the mast and went for the fin
in your case you have neither
where is the bigger bang for the buck ??
the sail will feel lighter with the right mast in higher carbon with more downhaul...
if you live near Montreal you could try my mast - but i am guessing the fin is tuttle on your board
here is the discussion of my board and kit
http://joewindsurfer.blogspot.ca/2012/07/bic-techno-formula.html
if you comment there - i will get an e-mail
I LOVE MY BTF in light winds Smile
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adywind



Joined: 08 Jan 2012
Posts: 201

PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2013 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I doubt a bigger fin will make a positive difference, but it doesn't hurt to try if you can borrow one. I think it will push the nose even more down at high speed . You can try more downhaul it tends to lift the nose a bit and it will make the rig feel lighter in transitions at the same time. You said you put the mast foot as far back as it goes and I assume you've put the foot straps back as well, have you? Boom at chin hight as well, but you did that already. Трудна работа Wink
I've checked the BIC catalog meanwhile and they say the Nova is a beginners board and the footstraps holes are placed farther forward then normal, which if true for yours as well will keep the board down no mater what. It may look like a formula but may have substantial differences not easily visible to be more beginners friendly. You can try some modifications if you want like adding footstrap holes ,I've seen treads with instructions on the speed forums, but it's a loosing battle IMO, you will never be satisfied with this board. My advice is to sell it and start looking for something faster and lighter. Don't go for a formula if you dont want to use sails bigger then the 9.5, but look instead for something like the Ultrasonic or the Super Lightwind or the Firemove or just any Freerace board in the maximum sizes, the lighter and stiffer -the better. I have the SuperSport 79 and I like it a lot, I only wish I could afford the carbon edition.


Last edited by adywind on Wed May 15, 2013 9:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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joethewindsufa



Joined: 10 Oct 2010
Posts: 179
Location: Montréal

PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

re-read the post
this board is NOT fast and not meant for mid-winds - i think
OP says 15 to 20 mph winds
yes, then i am presently going to a large shortboard with 8.x sail
this year intend to try the BIC Techno Formula in those winds with 8.x
so, OP needs to decide - ride it out - invest in current set-up or ??
see no reason to not ride it out and look around to see what others use
{try more downhaul ??}
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adywind



Joined: 08 Jan 2012
Posts: 201

PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

joethewindsufa wrote:
re-read the post
this board is NOT fast and not meant for mid-winds - i think
OP says 15 to 20 mph winds
yes, then i am presently going to a large shortboard with 8.x sail
this year intend to try the BIC Techno Formula in those winds with 8.x
so, OP needs to decide - ride it out - invest in current set-up or ??
see no reason to not ride it out and look around to see what others use
{try more downhaul ??}

Hey Joe, you don't make sense man.
It's all right, I've done worse things this late at night Embarassed
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sl55



Joined: 03 Aug 2007
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your rig looks very noodley to me. Get a proper SRS75 mast, and you'll be blown away (pun intended) how good the range of this sail is, and how light it is going to feel.
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