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Gun Nuts
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1930
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me, this typifies the false notion peddled by some in the GOP that wrongly attempts to equate banning certain guns with a government overreach at best and an erosion of not only the 2nd Amendment but other rights as well. Sen. Cruz was grandstanding a bit too much and had his lunch handed to him by Senators Feinstein and Leahy.

Why can't people understand that the least convincing argument on nearly any issue is that of the slippery slope. I hold no issue with honest, open debate about constitutional matters, but feel like crying when Senators attempt to rewrite about 200 years of jurisprudence while knowing their reasoning is false.

Sen. Cruz ate it in fashion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYI3MEhegvQ&feature=player_embedded

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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4018

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cruz is a very popular guy these days. The right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed. Small arms, those similar to what local police use should be allowed. However, just like police, semi auto weapons should require owners background check and training...Even that's infringing some would say.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13998

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
Small arms, those similar to what local police use should be allowed. However, just like police, semi auto weapons should require owners background check and training...Even that's infringing some would say.

??? Cops use virtually only semi-autos. Besides, one man proved that a man can fire 6 shots into a target from a revolver, reload, and fire 6 more shots into the target, all in <3 seconds.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1930
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
Cruz is a very popular guy these days. The right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed. Small arms, those similar to what local police use should be allowed. However, just like police, semi auto weapons should require owners background check and training...Even that's infringing some would say.


As I and others have written before, the 2nd Amendment is written poorly or at least unhelpfully for interpretation. It does say "shall not be infringed" but we all agree that there is no private right of ownership of shoulder-fired TOW missiles or fully-auto 30mm cannons. Therefore, "shall not be infringed" must be read to mean, shall not be "unreasonably infringed" or something synonymous.

Cruz and his followers must agree to some sort of restrictions if they also agree that there is no private ownership and "bearing" rights for tanks, flame throwers and bombs.

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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1930
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
Cruz is a very popular guy these days. The right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed. Small arms, those similar to what local police use should be allowed. However, just like police, semi auto weapons should require owners background check and training...Even that's infringing some would say.


As I and others have written before, the 2nd Amendment is written poorly or at least unhelpfully for interpretation. It does say "shall not be infringed" but we all agree that there is no private right of ownership of shoulder-fired TOW missiles or fully-auto 30mm cannons. Therefore, "shall not be infringed" must be read to mean, shall not be "unreasonably infringed" or something synonymous.

Cruz and his followers must agree to some sort of restrictions if they also agree that there is no private ownership and "bearing" rights for tanks, flame throwers and bombs.

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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4018

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Iso, I've always felt a revolver is a better self defense weapon than a semi auto, because they don't jam. Cops don't use revolvers because if a criminal grabs it, it won't fire after the 1st shot. They are seemingly easier to reload than a revolver.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 686

PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
Cops don't use revolvers because if a criminal grabs it, it won't fire after the 1st shot.

Please explain.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4018

PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy wrote:
stevenbard wrote:
Cops don't use revolvers because if a criminal grabs it, it won't fire after the 1st shot.

Please explain.


In order to fire a revolver, it must revolve. If the cop pull the gun and the criminal grabs the "revolver" and the hammer, it won't fire at all. Also can be used in self defense. However, I do believe the S&W M&P will fire if the purp grabs it.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 686

PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tow missiles and cannons are not firearms, nice try.
Seemingly reasonable controls on firearms sound perfectly acceptable on the face of it until one comes to understand the planned and systematic global assault on gun rights with examples of exactly the same scenario playing out in numerous other countries.
The slippery slope being quite slippery every misstep of the way.
Move along now, nothing to see here.
Gun control is a global movement funded and organized by stateist organizations like the UN, George Soros etc...
To claim that there is no slippery slope in regards to gun control is ignoring the very designs and actions of the gun grabbers themselves.
The slippery slope IS the plan.
Don't believe me? Just listen to the words that come from their mouths.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 686

PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
beaglebuddy wrote:
stevenbard wrote:
Cops don't use revolvers because if a criminal grabs it, it won't fire after the 1st shot.

Please explain.


In order to fire a revolver, it must revolve. If the cop pull the gun and the criminal grabs the "revolver" and the hammer, it won't fire at all. Also can be used in self defense. However, I do believe the S&W M&P will fire if the purp grabs it.

I think you are referring to the drill where the cop is trained to jam his hand into a perps revolver between the hammer and the breech of the barrel?
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