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Who's Heard of GT Masts?
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nodak



Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gary, thank you for posting. I take back what I'd said about your inventory; I made the comment prematurely based on a few SUPs being out of stock prior to settling with your 11" NSP CocoMat that was in stock. In fact you had Streamlined carbon extentions and bases in Europin when even Streamlined didn't have them. I have no way of knowing about your inventory.

Regarding the mast I'd returned: yes, you gave me a full refund with no questions asked. The 400 75% is only a small part of what I'd purchased from you last year. If you notice I'm more annoyed at myself for being too cheap and for not doing prior research. In the end it cost me more to get rid of both the NP Atlas and your mast. And of course: it's always Caveat Emptor (nevermind its real estate reference), though I wish John would've advised me against buying it; I specifically asked about the mast's compatibility with the Atlas.

This is such a small thing in the grand scheme of things. This forum is about the only place anyone can vent about buying the wrong kind of mast.
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gstone



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:37 pm    Post subject: GT masts Reply with quote

Thanks so much for your additional post. We would NEVER knowingly send a mast out that was not a proper fit for a sail. Jon made the recommendation knowing it would be a reasonable fit though certainly a Neil Pryde mast would have been ideal. I have personally tested the
older Neil Pryde Alpha 5.0m2 (the Atlas replaced the Alpha) with the GT mast, the Ezzy RDM and the Neil Pryde RDM masts and found them to be similar. None of our sales team would ever knowingly lead you the wrong direction. Please let me know next time you wish to order something so I can do something extra to make up for your experience.
Kind regards,
Gary Stone
Isthmus Sailboards
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 2972
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It must be very difficult to be a retailer, I'm certain that Isthmus has gobs of happy customers:

The GT mast is said to have a constant curve, this the description from their site in () .
Reading it is constant curve says that the mast is middle of the road in curve department, CC is NOT what suits Neil Pryde.

One would also gather , and a very reasonable assumption that since they say the TIP is Neil Pryde acceptable then the mast is also

(Features:
100% Carbon content
2-pc construction
Reduced Diameter profile
Constant curve design
Includes quality padded mast bag
Glossy finish for ease of rigging
Tip plug accommodates wide range of male pin designs… GT, Ezzy, Neil Pryde, …)


compatibility of mast to sail is more than saying where it falls in the IMCS terms, only some considerations are :
Overall stiffness

2) The ratios between the mid, ¼ and ¾ bend points.

3) The carbon content

4) The carbon orientation. More zero axis fibers = better reflex



It is possible to have a softer mast that feels stiffer because of the carbon orientation.

What does we will make it right mean ?

Welcome to the forum Mr Stone .

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5433

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstone,

Regarding your GT masts, what is their bend curve? I understand that they are constant curve type masts, but what are the bend percentages (bottom and top, i.e. 64/76) that you originally specified to your subcontractor?
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gstone



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It must be very difficult to be a retailer, I'm certain that Isthmus has gobs of happy customers:

We enjoy it. Have been selling windsurf gear for 28 years and counting.

The GT mast is said to have a constant curve, this the description from their site in () .
Reading it is constant curve says that the mast is middle of the road in curve department, CC is NOT what suits Neil Pryde.

The reality is cc does not tell the whole story which you indicate quite clearly below. In my own testing the feel of the GT mast was not dramatically different than the Neil Pryde RDM mast for the particular masts and on the particular Neil Pryde sail I was comparing.

One would also gather , and a very reasonable assumption that since they say the TIP is Neil Pryde acceptable then the mast is also

(Features:
100% Carbon content We offer a 75% and a 100% but in the 400 cm only the 75%
2-pc construction yes
Reduced Diameter profile yes
Constant curve design yes but as you know even cc masts vary in actual bend percentages to a certain extent.
Includes quality padded mast bag Generally yes.
Glossy finish for ease of rigging yes
Tip plug accommodates wide range of male pin designs… GT, Ezzy, Neil Pryde, …) yes


compatibility of mast to sail is more than saying where it falls in the IMCS terms, only some considerations are :

You are absolutely correct in everything you say here.

Overall stiffness

2) The ratios between the mid, ¼ and ¾ bend points.

3) The carbon content

4) The carbon orientation. More zero axis fibers = better reflex



It is possible to have a softer mast that feels stiffer because of the carbon orientation.

What does we will make it right mean ?

It is extremely rare we have an unhappy customer. When a customer is unhappy we do what it takes to remedy the situation.

Take care

Welcome to the forum Mr Stone .
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pete1111



Joined: 16 Apr 2005
Posts: 117
Location: The Dude

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been getting gear from Isthmus for the past 10 years and NEVER have been given bad advice or gear . Garry and Jon are one of the most honest guys in the industry.
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 2972
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to respond to the GT mast question that was not dramatically different than the Neil Pryde mast, any mast will work in any sail,
it depends on how much range you have to start with, and how much range you are willing to give up.

I would find it remarkable that a mast that performs to the sails potential in a Ezzy sail would also work at a acceptable level with a Neil Pryde sail, who I consider a very fine product, just in a world of their own ie Gaastra, Maui Sails, some Naish in regards to mast bend curve , just at the other end of soft/flex top curve. But whats acceptable and performance potential is relative to who makes the judgement.

I have found that SDM masts in a slightly off mast bend curve are much more likely to work than a RDM also off, point the curve to the sale is more important than the size of the mast. The case here is a 75% RDM.

Reading the entire thread their are posters who say if the sail calls for a RDM then any RDM will do, this certainly has NOT been the case in my experience.

Because a mast is made in the same factory as others , much like boards in Cobra does not mean that the materials are the same, course they could be. Course they could be USA made as well

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5433

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstone,

It appears that I asked a question that you're unable to answer. I presume that must be the case since it was something that you failed to address in response to U2U2U2's post too. I thought it would be something you would know given the fact that you must have provided specifications to your European subcontractor. Then again, maybe you simply asked for constant curve type masts and left all the details up to them.
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gstone



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:59 am    Post subject: RE: question by SW Chandler Reply with quote

Dear SW Chandler,

Please clarify what question I did not answer. Then I will answer it.
Thank you.
Gary
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5433

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gstone,

Here is what I originally asked.

"Regarding your GT masts, what is their bend curve? I understand that they are constant curve type masts, but what are the bend percentages (bottom and top, i.e. 64/76) that you originally specified to your subcontractor?"

Here is what U2U2U2 noted:

"compatibility of mast to sail is more than saying where it falls in the IMCS terms, only some considerations are :

You are absolutely correct in everything you say here.

Overall stiffness

2) The ratios between the mid, ¼ and ¾ bend points.

3) The carbon content

4) The carbon orientation. More zero axis fibers = better reflex"

In my original question, I even gave you an example of a bend percentage of a mast (64/76%), which happens to be the one that's ideal for my sails. U2U2U2, in his second point on overall stiffness, cites the bearing for testing a mast to objectively identify it's specific bend characteristics of the top and bottom of the mast. It's important to note that when a mast manufacturer develops a schedule for material orientation, they need to formulate it in such a way that determines overall flex, to include the specific flex characteristics at the top and the bottom of the mast. By now, I think that most folks that have been involved in windsurfing for any period of time know that sail designers create their sails to correspond with what they consider to be their ideal mast. Unfortunately not all sail designers share the same idea of the ideal mast. That leaves us consumers with a paradox of sorts when trying to mix and match sails with masts. So when it comes down to buying a mast these days from a retailer, it's important that the retailer understands what's going on with different products out there to better service their customer's needs and ensure overall satisfaction. You might want to familiarize yourself with the information in the following link that U2U2U2 posted in another thread here.

http://www.unifiber.net/2013/mast-selector
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