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Gun Nuts
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3548
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm still stuck on the visual of Mr. and Mrs. ISO at a gun seminar.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1941
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
rigitrite wrote:
the 2nd amendment needs to go.

Got ANY facts/data to support that?
Connecticut law already forbid everything that nut did; what good did it do?

My wife and I attended a free 2-hours general handgun seminar yesterday, taught by a 19-year SWAT officer who also competes nationally in rapid-fire competition ... alongside his wife and his very highly ranked 14-yo daughter. The 75-seat classroom was almost packed ... and they had to schedule 11 more such classes to meet the demand.

His messages were clear:
1. Compliance with four very basic rules will keep the vast majority of gun owners safe.
2. Police encourage the arming of rational, law-abiding, competent citizens who want to bear arms. It strongly tilts the playing field towards the good guys. The instructor told us he'd guarantee that there were several concealed weapons in the audience, and that that was fine by him, as he was unarmed.)
3. If you find the gun you want, you'd better snap it up now at any price. The demand is skyrocketing, the pipeline is overwhelmed, and no one knows how far the law may go in response to emotional overreaction by this administration (and its legislature, if they have any say in it). [Tip: Buy guns, not gold. There's no capital gains tax on guns sold by a private owner at a profit]


Mike, I hope you read this because your post adds room for respectable commentary.

I don't support removing the 2nd Amendment, but that a murderer broke the law is besides the point. I believe the idea behind most repeal efforts is not to ban all firearms but to effectively amend the 2nd Amendment to limit what firearms would be allowable, and this requires a new Amendment as one cannot amend an Amendment. In any case, attempting to connect the lack of enforcement of a prohibitive, criminal law to support a law of allowance (the 2nd Amendment) doesn't work logically. One does not lead to the other.

Most shooters employ firearms allowable under current 2nd Amendment jurisprudence (no murders by a nut dragging an anti-aircraft battery into a theater). The laws broken included modification of a semi-automatic weapon to fire continuously, using a gun that is unregistered at all, to them or otherwise owned by another, and using it to murder.

A proposed 28th Amendment that limits firearms without outright banning would at the very least prevent the importation, manufacture, distribution and sale of these firearms going forward. This would prove very effective at reducing the number of banned firearms over time.

I appreciate that you don't support this, but wished to clarify the missing logic in the "weak enforcement" argument. If a child keeps stabbing the dog with a sharp knife, parental decision to remove knife access from the child is the only sure way to prevent the child from using a knife on the dog. Simply trying to stop the kid before the stabbing would occur without removing the knife would be laughable.

What are the lecturer's four basic rules designed to keep gun owners safe? Your post didn't say.

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5199

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Give the dog an AR-15.
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2396

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:


Your rationale and fervor would save millions more lives if applied to automobiles, smoking, and obesity.
All three of which society has regulated, or tried to eliminate.
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jpbassking



Joined: 19 May 1998
Posts: 2369
Location: Leo

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:05 pm    Post subject: Clinton gun laws Reply with quote

The second amendment survived the Clinton gun laws, why not re-institute that?
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1395

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gun nuts and paranoia seem to go hand-in-hand. That such arguments gain traction with some of our friends, like Bard, is really sad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=p1Ddb3oa5CE#!

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5199

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Give Piers a muzzle. This guy is crazier than Iso.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5808

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, Alex Jones is really a rude and anxious character that obviously can't carry on a rational debate or conversation. He must be one of those rabid off-the-top talk radio nutcases that isobars worships, and where he eagerly gathers his gun loving talking points. Given isobars' conduct here on this forum, it's not hard to imagine that he would do the same kind of thing as Jones if encountered in a public venue or on stage.
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FarLeft



Joined: 20 Dec 2012
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Isobars,
Regarding your cop-point #1 - In CA, we have 6 basic gun safety rules... I wonder which 2 you guys found unnecessary? Ehh, probably needless California nanny-worry.

Regarding cop-point #3 - Almost all of the addition gun-sales are from idiots who've never shot a gun before, buying AR's, stripped lowers and 5.56 surplus. They're the reciprocal of the idiots who believe banning assault weapons is a meaningful step toward any current public safety issue. Still plenty of AK's, mini-14's, and M1a's to be had. The morons that would want to ban them haven't figured out their a problem yet (mainly because they're not) so their moronic equivalent counterparts haven't figured out they want to own one.

People are stupid. Here's more evidence:

Gun Safety video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et33bbA0GeM


Complete video of my favorite clip from the above sequence. The audio alone is priceless.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zw-jTCNZSmY

You've got to at least admire the guy's composure.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3548
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its stunning to me that a clown like Alex Jones has a radio show. Its even more stunning that millions of Americans listen everyday. Its the battle of the Amendments , 2 v 1.
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