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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2281

PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big guys are fast, simple and rewarding for them.
Us little guys need much higher skill levels, and can almost get the same speeds. NOBODY who can' jibe at least 70 % can stay with me, at 150 lbs.
Tons of big guys who jibe bettet than 70% blow my doors off.
Well, that's not really true. I can sail pretty even with TysonPoor, and he was second in the USNats in slalom last year.
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shredder33



Joined: 13 Jun 2000
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saw your post about looking for a jump board. I have been chasing Dale around for the last 8 years and trying to figure out how he does it. I've tried using all kinds of configurations to get closer to the speed and control he has. I've ridden all of his boards and custom 4.2 huckers. I have to say that if you like to jump.... copy his gear selection. It has been fine tuned with probably 20 years of tweeking, and that's on the shoulders of Bruce Peterson and his 15 years prior. Bruce and Rob (of Roberts) have worked together to truly achieve a epic combo for jumping and speed. Once you dial it in and get used to that speed it really feels like a new sport (or like it used to feel in the old days when you were white-knunckled!). Launching and getting the height Dale gets is 100% skill and 100% balls (yep, that's 200%!). But getting the speed and control is the first part of the equation. In my experience that means riding a narrow (20.5/68L 20.75/75L-85L) Board with a flatten mid section. Robert's "wave Slalom" boards actually have a little rocker in the tail which makes them turn quite nice, but a small tail is best. Probably the most important part is the fin, g-10 26cm 28cm CNC pointer (ish) I have a Techtonics falcon, Dale uses a Eagle (slightly more point) Bruce uses a Gold wing I believe on his 8-4 (though I don't get to sail with him often) so I could be off. But really I can't over-stress the fin quality and shape. If you have a bomber fin (that's clean.....) it won't slide out and you have the confidence to push your limits. The board shape is only important in that a wave rocker won't handle the higher center of efforts of good fast jump sails (ie.Huckers) and will push the boards nose down into the troughs slowing you down, and potentially throwing you over the bars. The flatter rocker keeps this from happening, though it's harder on the knees! I would suggest finding an older Roberts and putting a good fin on it. You'll have a blast! Good luck! See you at the Hatch!
-Antonio
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mchaco1



Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 643

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great stuff! Very Happy I love your youtube videos BTW, really got me excited about going fast and getting starting with jumping. Im meant to chat with you when I saw you there last time, but you derigged so fast that you were gone before I dragged my gear up and got changed. I studied Dales board too, it really struck me how sharp the rails were and how much it looked like a tiny version of an older pro-tech slalom board I had when I was starting out. I also noticed that your fin looked really tiny and pointy compared to what everyone else was using. Ill definitely pick up something like that if I can find it. In the mean time ill be pushing the old tempo until it gets to cold to for me to handle..
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13803

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

shredder33 wrote:
The board shape is only important in that a wave rocker won't handle the higher center of efforts of good fast jump sails (ie.Huckers) and will push the boards nose down into the troughs slowing you down, and potentially throwing you over the bars.

Glad to hear that from a real-deal expert! That was precisely my impression when I sailed a Hucker for a few days on my wave and turny B&J boards, especially little ones. I understood the geometry of how the high COE would load up the board nose (and work the rider harder), but I hadn't factored the rocker into the arithmetic.

A simple cure, of course, is to downhaul the sail 'til its COE moves down to the booms, but that deletes much of its altitude and hang time advantages, leaving a merely excellent modern sail.

It's always reassuring to have my amateur opinions vetted. Unfortunately for others, it encourages me to keep on typin'. Wink

As for "getting the speed and control is the first part of the equation. In my experience that means riding a narrow (20.5/68L 20.75/75L-85L) Board" ... I never had any doubts about that one in the presence of any chop.

Thanks for the explanation.

Mike \m/
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2281

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Board..... look for a mid '90's state of the art 8'8" bump n jump, with a flavor for speed. RogueWave, Roberts, Seatrend, HyperTech, Priester, Pettit, don't matter. All are 8'8" x 20" wide with narrow tails, double straps well back, slalom rails. Should not cost more than $150.
Sail.... very well powered is more important than anything else. Some upwind is good for angle, you can adjust downhaul for feel.
Fin.... fast pointer or blade. Pointers are easier to land, blades slightly faster, but landing take perfection, and are longer, so can stress decks and finboxes.
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2281

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That was dreamland 20-33 mph winds.
Back to reality, get a fast slalom board, whatever liters floats your boat, be the fastest sailor on the water, you will jump the highest.
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mchaco1



Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 643

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zirtaeb wrote:
That was dreamland 20-33 mph winds.
Back to reality, get a fast slalom board, whatever liters floats your boat, be the fastest sailor on the water, you will jump the highest.


But thats pretty much the wind around here... Your description above pretty well describes the Tempo, 8'8 skinny and "slalom/wave".
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mchaco1



Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 643

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

shredder33 wrote:
The board shape is only important in that a wave rocker won't handle the higher center of efforts of good fast jump sails (ie.Huckers) and will push the boards nose down into the troughs slowing you down, and potentially throwing you over the bars.

That comment makes me want to try my realwinds 5.7 again. It felt like a catapult machine on my wave boards, but maybe the Tempo can handle it and take advantage of the high COE
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zirtaeb



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2281

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Compared to a slalom board, Tempo's speed was like a 4 out of 10.
Yes, it was faster than the 264 Wave, but not much else.
Bic's Adagio, E-Rocks, Veloce's, Vivace's were faster to much faster.
OTOH, you HAVE the Tempo.
OK, HipHop was slower, but that was a dog.
Consider a Flow 94, or any Sputnik, or Bee, which are clearly, easily noticably much faster.
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mchaco1



Joined: 08 Sep 2010
Posts: 643

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zirtaeb wrote:
Compared to a slalom board, Tempo's speed was like a 4 out of 10.
Yes, it was faster than the 264 Wave, but not much else.
Bic's Adagio, E-Rocks, Veloce's, Vivace's were faster to much faster.
OTOH, you HAVE the Tempo.
OK, HipHop was slower, but that was a dog.
Consider a Flow 94, or any Sputnik, or Bee, which are clearly, easily noticably much faster.

I have an Erock too, I always felt like the Tempo was quite a bit faster..maybe its the fin.
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