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8.5m sail VS a 7.5 for earlie planing
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3090
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

will do an update.

This was a rather perplexing choice to go 8.5, as in the past I always felt

if the winds weren't 7.5 then I would not sail.

oh.....puffin

No plans to drop off anytime soon

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5966

PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

U2U2U2, I hate to mention it, but going up in size isn't always the answer. I bought an 8.3 and a mast to go with it, but I haven't used it for some time now. It's not that it isn't a good sail. Going for the lightest of winds is a test of one's will and need.

While I have no intent to get rid of it, I'll need to power up a bit to get the stoke to use it some more. The bigger the sail, the more work is required. If the wind dies, particularly on your outside reach, the result will test you.

As you're now committed, I'll wait for your reports in the near future.
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3090
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm certain it will benefit the Formula board greatly.

Just a few weeks here in Colorado would have you and your 8.3 all dusted off.
looking forward to the new tech on cams and all the bennies

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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1518

PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sail size decisions and judging if one should go out or not varies considerably based upon: where you live, typical conditions, skills, seasons, ability to get out if there is wind, equipment, weight, personal preference, available funds, etc., etc.

Some folks are plenty satisfied with going out with nothing bigger than a 6.5 or 7.5, usually because they have all the wind the desire for planing as often as they wish.

Others find that to get planing during a good portion of the year, they need big stuff (9-11 meter sails and wide boards).

Others don't care much if they plane or not and are happy cruising on longboards.

Where I live (Dallas) we have plenty of decent winds in the fall, winter & spring, when I almost never go out with anything larger than a 7.6 (most outings during these months are on average - on a 6.0.

However, to sail in July, August, and Sept, one needs big stuff (formula with either a 9.2 or 11.0) to plane. Last week I was out on my 11.0 in 8-14 knots of wind and hit 28.3 mph of board speed. It was a fun day. I weight 166 lbs and am 67 years old.

It takes some thought and time to analyze your individual situation to figure out what is best for you. Then after you figure it out, it will undoubtedly change in another year or two. It's the nature of the sport.
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3090
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This thread had some good rationale for both sizes, so I thought I would follow up after trying the 8.5 VS the 7.5.

It never felt bigger carrying to the water, as in heavier, but the way back in it certainly did feel big and heavy

Waterstarting the 8.5 was a big ass pain.

The size seemed to impact the Tabou 135L more so than the Formula board,
it was not too much sail, and was easy to handle, but what I think ::the Formula would need a 9.5 to achieve much earlier planing, where the Rocket felt the 1m difference much more.

From an economic standpoint, so $$ spent, it was a mediocre decision , not much in the way of gain.

In part the wind conditions were off for an entire month, where I should have been overpowered on the 8.5 at least occasionally, actually only occured once and never on the 7.5 which also should have occurred.

In the past I have been on much smaller sails. So it all may be just a weak ass season on the East coast.

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DelmarEdward



Joined: 05 Aug 2012
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

U2-I have a 9.9 sailworks sail which is a four cam sail. I was thinking of getting an Aerotech 11 Rapid Fire which only has 2 cams like the Lion. Do you think the 2 cam Lion took on less water in the luff pocket than a fully cammed sail would?

What was the wind speed when you took out the Lion? Did you try to uphaul it also?
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3090
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DelmarEdward wrote:
U2-I have a 9.9 sailworks sail which is a four cam sail. I was thinking of getting an Aerotech 11 Rapid Fire which only has 2 cams like the Lion. Do you think the 2 cam Lion took on less water in the luff pocket than a fully cammed sail would?

What was the wind speed when you took out the Lion? Did you try to uphaul it also?


probably but not more or less to make any difference, the rotation of more cams ,or lack of it would be more noticeable.

10--25mph

uphaul 95% of the time, used this sail almost exclusive for a month

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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 172

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm 155 as well, sailing in Colorado as well.
I have a 7.0 for winds between 10-20. I have a 9.2 for winds 10-15.

10-15mph = 9.2 + formula.
10-20mph = 7.0 + formula
15-20mph = 7.0 + 105

Your 135 should take the 8.5 quite well, it would be a great summer sail or any day where 10-15 steady winds. Technique and 7.5 should help you going in the gusts but won't cruise through lulls as well as a 8.5 with appropriate fin to go with it.

What is the rest of your quiver looking like? What do you like doing the most?
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 1968
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two or maybe three (or four) challenges to waterstarting big sails:

1. Heavy in dead weight and full of water;

2. High booms;

3. No way to rest booms on board's tail; and/or

4. Wide boards are harder to waterstart no matter what.

Points two and four are the biggies. It is hard to bring any wide board under your butt in light air and high booms make it more difficult to get the rig vertical during the step up onto the board. These combine to slide the board downwind.

My top tip: orient board pointing on a true reach and move farther forward on board when stepping up. Drop front hand to mast and allow the huge sail to pull you from a somewhat squatting position. Either that, or waterstart conventionally with a very aggressive step up onto the board, then drop low. This can be hard to do with the high booms.

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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 3090
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

manuel wrote:
I'm 155 as well, sailing in Colorado as well.
I have a 7.0 for winds between 10-20. I have a 9.2 for winds 10-15.

10-15mph = 9.2 + formula.
10-20mph = 7.0 + formula
15-20mph = 7.0 + 105

Your 135 should take the 8.5 quite well, it would be a great summer sail or any day where 10-15 steady winds. Technique and 7.5 should help you going in the gusts but won't cruise through lulls as well as a 8.5 with appropriate fin to go with it.

What is the rest of your quiver looking like? What do you like doing the most?


the Rocket 135 does indeed handle the 8.5 nicely, perhaps you mis -understood something previous, the effect on performance was more profound on the Rocket than the Formula board, to achieve the same improvement the Formula would need a 9.5m sail, VS the 7.5m, the original question.

sail quiver you mean looking like ...? 2.9m 3.7 4.0 4.7 4.7 5.0 5.0 5.3 5.5 5.5 5.7 6.0 6.3 6.5 7.5 8.5

like the most ? type of sailing ? Rio Vista or Hood River

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