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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4121

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pueno, I underlined Bush's name on purpose. Furthemore I consider Bush one of our more inept presidents, and always have. (even before he took office). This is not Bush v Obama.

Talk about being a fool Pueno, I don't want the govt telling me what I can or can't do inside my own home. Furthermore, I suspect by your opinions that you enjoy being one of the sheep, in the trough line.


But the biggest point I was making is that these policies HURT THE POOR, and that some bureaucrat who's not as smart as me can waive his hand and deem just about anything you or I do a crime.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14173

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fluorescents might be a no-brainer if it breaking one didn't trigger a hazmat event and the whole concept didn't elevate the mercury environment so much.
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2396

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
, I don't want the govt telling me what I can or can't do inside my own home.

How's that meth lab working out?

_________________
/w\
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2670

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:

Talk about being a fool Pueno, I don't want the govt telling me what I can or can't do inside my own home. Furthermore, I suspect by your opinions that you enjoy being one of the sheep, in the trough line.

What you don't realize (or won't acknowledge) is that your actions have impact on everybody. If you choose to use an inefficient light source, then:
- You consume more of earth's resources than you should, and
- Your actions produce more pollution.

Using more resources drives the fuel cost up for EVERYBODY. Creating more pollutions fouls the air for EVERYBODY. So, your actions affect more than you alone.

I bet you advocate for no motorcycle helmet laws, too. After all, it's only the rider who's left to be a vegetable, right?


isobars wrote:

Fluorescents might be a no-brainer if it breaking one didn't trigger a hazmat event and the whole concept didn't elevate the mercury environment so much.

Society has been throwing out fluorescent tubes for decades with nary a hiccup from the right. But, when guys like you can twist it into some Obama hate, then you do.

And then you show up.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5818

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"But the biggest point I was making is that these policies HURT THE POOR, and that some bureaucrat who's not as smart as me can waive his hand and deem just about anything you or I do a crime."


Are you really that concerned about hurting the poor, or are you using them as a convenience in this particular rant. Your usual argument is that the poor need to get responsible and not be so dependent on the government and the US taxpayer.

I have to say that your concept of some knuckle dragging bureaucrat running roughshod over the good folks of this country is straight out of Fox News or some right wing internet blog. It's just manufactured outrage that is completely incongruent with reality. I think that it's fair to say that the bureaucrats in the EPA, or some other department in the government, are simply following and enforcing laws that our representatives in government pass and agree upon.

From what I've read here about the laws passed that you're so upset about, I really have no problem at all. As time moves on, so much in life changes. While change isn't always easy or convenient, sometimes it needs to be embraced for the good of all. You can't always go back in time.

I too remember in my youth that the milkman delivered milk in glass bottles right on your doorstep, and also picked up the empties so they can be used again. Although that time is long passed, newer laws have been passed to promote recycling of almost everything we use. The responsibility and effort to recycle might be a little more of a hassle for folks, yet it's certainly a better way to go than throwing everything away in the trash to be carted away and hidden somewhere, or irresponsibly littered into environment. I seriously doubt that you're against littering laws designed to promote a cleaner healthier environment. Do you remember the days when everyone in LA used to have incinerators to burn their trash and pollute the air? I don't know about you, but I'm sure glad that that's no longer legal.
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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1945

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
Quote:
If you live in a warm climate with a relatively well insulated newer house, you might be impressed with how quickly you pay for the lower heat producing bulbs on your air conditioning bill.


If you live in a cold climate, then heating cost will go up with the new bulbs. Overall, it's probably a wash.


No...not even close. Lighting and airconditioning use an average of nearly 50% of the electricity used in commercial buildings. Heating, by average is 6%. Summary...don't use light bulbs for heating.

That said...when I take off to Baja for a month, the only electricity running in my house is a 100 watt light bulb in my pantry to keep the food from freezing. Dang, I'm gonna miss those bulbs. Shocked
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3370

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For reasons cited by Coboard there are few buildings beside homes that have incandescent anyway.
In many places in the third world, only the rich have them. Poor people use tube style flourescents because they use so much less power and are just as cheap to buy as the others.
The law is really not against you doing anything in your home. It is similar to the laws mandating gas mileage in cars being sold. Those laws pissed me off because cars became slow and more costly, but in the end they pushed the auto industry to listen to their engineers and double the fuel economy. My sports car can get 34 MPG and goes 150 (but not at the same time).

As pueno says i find it amusing that talking heads get so worked up against Obamas lighting crime against humanity while sitting under exactly the same flourescent lights on TV or the radio and hoping you are too dumb to know that.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2670

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
I don't want the govt telling me what I can or can't do inside my own home . . . . . . . and that some bureaucrat who's not as smart as me can waive his hand and deem just about anything you or I do a crime.

It's no crime to use a 100-watt light bulb. Nobody will take you or me away for using light bulbs. You can use those 100-watt bulbs until your great-great-great-grandchildren are old and grey and nobody will care. NOBODY is telling you that you can't use those light bulbs.

Nobody is telling you that you can't use 150 octane gasoline in your car, either.

It's just that those bulbs and that gas will not be available for you to use -- so you must find alternatives.

-----------

You guys are truly entertaining, as you twist into pretzels manufacturing indignant outrage over nothing, all in your attempt to propagate hate for Obama. I love it.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 1477

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

keycocker said:
Quote:
The law is really not against you doing anything in your home. It is similar to the laws mandating gas mileage in cars being sold.

While I am not all the bugged by the light bulb mandate, there is a significant difference between the lights and car mileage.

The government hasn't mandated that no car can be produced that doesn't get at least (35 mpg - pick a number), but that is essentially what they are saying about light bulbs, we no longer have a choice, we must buy expensive energy efficient bulbs. The day will come when the only powerful car produced will be electric or a hybrid. We may not like it, but a couple of hundred years down the road, the remaining oil will be needed for other more important products rather than moving cars.

My only issue is crying wolf and pushing too fast for changes when a slower more responsible pace may meet our needs. This statement can be debated from all directions, but don't bother, it's just my opinion.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5818

PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"My only issue is crying wolf and pushing too fast for changes when a slower more responsible pace may meet our needs."


Maybe Apple was pushing things to fast with the concept and the introduction of a point and click driven personal home computer. The pace of change is so damn demanding and upsetting. Pretty soon owning a computer will no longer be an option in life. It will be a mandatory requirement to live in the modern world. I guess the same can be said about cellphones (so far, I've never owned one). Sometimes, there's no going back to simpler times.
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