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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1393

PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrgybe wrote:
feuser wrote:
Well, then let's keep condescension out of the debate, as well:


Condescension is a show of disdain and superiority in which the condescending person considers himself superior............that is quite different from actually being superior!!


LOL. Thanks for that.

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florian - ny22

http://www.windsurfing.kasail.com/
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5688

PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Robust, but respectful debate should be a vital element of our society. Unfortunately. that type of exchange is disappearing............honest differences of opinion are too often characterized as bigotry, racism or hatred."

I'm with you on this. Still though, some could jump to criticize my commentary specifically directed towards isobars. Yet, even as brutal as I am in my candor about him, and my obvious dedication in highlighting his twisted and hateful nature, I think that my comments remain reasonably civil overall. Some may disagree, but I can live with that.

I wonder though, whether isobars sees himself in "the ranks of the name callers and finger pointers", or in the ranks of those whose opinion is "too often characterized as bigotry, racism or hatred". He probably doesn't have a clue, and he sees himself safely in your corner by thinking you're only criticizing those more liberal contributors here. If he only knew the truth.
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1393

PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrgybe wrote:
"Robust, but respectful debate should be a vital element of our society. Unfortunately. that type of exchange is disappearing............honest differences of opinion are too often characterized as bigotry, racism or hatred."


The debate is destined to go bad because we cannot persuade each other with a line of argument following logical thinking. The reason we think so differently is not because either side comes to illogical conclusions; it seems to be a matter of premise. Perhaps you might call it values.

In the process of this discussion, I am discovering that I am a conservative, in terms of values. Compassion, law and order, fairness - all that leads me to a position that is squarely liberal. It is my honest opinion, not an accusation, that some of the premises that stand behind the Tea Party line of reasoning - as represented here by Isobars - are, in my world view, immoral.

The attempt to split the part of the population receiving government assistance into deserving and undeserving is in itself problematic. However, that this split follows predictably alongside the lines of racial and social stereotypes, betrays the fact that such judgement is generally not the result of honest investigation, but a superficial - usually instinctive - reaction to being confronted with inciting facts.

I will listen to a social worker, if he/she makes the case against government support. I do reject a 20,000 foot view and the resulting, mostly sweeping dismissal of the needs of people in crisis.

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florian - ny22

http://www.windsurfing.kasail.com/
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3212

PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iso definition of welfare is "money paid to anyone I consider less deserving than me.which is everyone"
The Tea Party has plenty of normal folks who don't accept Talk Radio BS.
Clinton listened to social workers make a case against welfare abuse .
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