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What should we do about guns?
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 4993

PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:05 pm    Post subject: What should we do about guns? Reply with quote

Without question, the tragedy in Tucson was made worse by the ease with which a disturbed man could get a semi-automatic weapon. Without such a weapon, fewer people would have been shot. Despite the claims that gun ownership will make us safer because we'll be able to defend ourselves, the fusillade of gunfire was over in a few minutes. Each year an estimated 2000,000 people are shot, and more than 30,000 die from gun violence--18,000 of whom are suicides.

The Democrats will certainly introduce gun control legislation, probably of a rather extreme nature to exploit the politics of this tragedy. In equal ideological support, the Republicans have already announced that any such legislation is dead on arrival.

We cannot keep guns out of the hands of criminals without dramatically changing our culture. And the Supreme Court has ruled that gun ownership is a fundamental right. So gun ownership cannot be banned, but can be regulated. While I think that the Republican position is short-sighted, and will hurt them politically, I'm more interested in seeing some consensus develop as to what can reasonably be done, particularly about the ability of disturbed people to buy guns, even if they usually kill themselves, and automatic weapons. Thoughts?
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jpbassking



Joined: 19 May 1998
Posts: 2354
Location: Leo

PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah yes Mac, a subject that is near and dear to my heart.

Perhaps the real question is what can we do about disturbed people?

As the law stands right now if you have a fellony conviction then you cannot legally purchase a gun. So what do these people do? They either steal them or purchase them from someone who has. Perhaps they
should add certain kinds of misdomeaners to the list? The 10 day waiting period is so that angry people will get over it. I don't know but some people can stay angry for a long time (anyone we know?)

It is indeed an interesting queston because while the world would be better off without guns, you could never get them all and even if you could people would make them.

I don't want to sound too NRA here but I don't think the problem is with the gun but more with the way people treat each other. That being said I believe the L.A. times reported the murder rate being the lowest that it has been in decades.

As tragic as this incident was (and I don't mean to play it down) it is still a very uncommon occurence.

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What should we do about guns?

Take them from criminals and give several to each prisoner in all of our high security prisons. One solution to two problems.
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jpbassking



Joined: 19 May 1998
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also I think the NRA needs to understand that it has members who are Democrats and the Democratic party needs to understand that it has members who are NRA members.
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Last edited by jpbassking on Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good points JP. Look to Canada. They have the same number of guns as USA per capita, but dont have the same level of automatic or semi-automatic weapons. Yet, their homicide rate is 1/10th the USA. Maybe they just treat each other better up North....I really think we're just an overly stressed out society.
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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
Posts: 1393

PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jpbassking wrote:
Also I think the NRA needs to understand that it has members who are Democrats and the Democratic partys needs to understand that it has members who are NRA members.


Perhaps that's why it's so ineffective to draw the line along the pro or anti-gun culture.

I don't expect gun owners to change from one to the other only so they can vote with me on all the other issues. However, I can expect that responsible gun owners who want to keep their guns to accept a bit more scrutiny and perhaps difficulty in purchasing guns and ammo.

Gun ownership should have at least the same number of control mechanisms we see required in vehicle ownership - from licensing to mandatory contributions into an insurance pool that compensates victims of gun violence and their survivors.

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jpbassking



Joined: 19 May 1998
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

boggsman1 wrote:
Good points JP. Look to Canada. They have the same number of guns as USA per capita, but dont have the same level of automatic or semi-automatic weapons. Yet, their homicide rate is 1/10th the USA. Maybe they just treat each other better up North....I really think we're just an overly stressed out society.


I think you're right Boggs, we are an overly stressed out society. So why is that?

Florian, California law requires a person to take a safety test prior to purchasing a hand gun with former Military and law enforcement personal being exempt. It is not a license though, just a certificate of completion.

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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
What should we do about guns?

Take them from criminals and give several to each prisoner in all of our high security prisons. One solution to two problems.

How do you know what mac posted?

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feuser



Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jpbassking wrote:
boggsman1 wrote:
Good points JP. Look to Canada. They have the same number of guns as USA per capita, but dont have the same level of automatic or semi-automatic weapons. Yet, their homicide rate is 1/10th the USA. Maybe they just treat each other better up North....I really think we're just an overly stressed out society.


I think you're right Boggs, we are an overly stressed out society. So why is that?

Florian, California law requires a person to take a safety test prior to purchasing a hand gun with former Military and law enforcement personal being exempt. It is not a license though, just a certificate of completion.


I don't think that's enough. The permits should be renewable and without a permit you shouldn't be able to purchase ammo. In order to renew you should have to account for your weapons. No more 'oops, where'd I put it' while someone is being robbed or murdered with a 'lost' weapon.

That and a mandatory victim/survivor insurance would make it considerably more expensive to own guns, but I don't think that is a major detractor for people who are serious and responsible weapon owners.

There is a case in my wife's family where a sole bread winner was fatally shot during a robbery and the survivors were left scrambling. Why do we make others pay the real price of gun ownership?

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coboardhead



Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1922

PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boggsman said

Quote:
Good points JP. Look to Canada. They have the same number of guns as USA per capita, but dont have the same level of automatic or semi-automatic weapons. Yet, their homicide rate is 1/10th the USA. Maybe they just treat each other better up North....I really think we're just an overly stressed out society.


And North Dakota has a lower homicide rate than Canada. Switzerland has a high rate of hand gun ownership and a much lower homicide rate.

Its not the guns, folks. Switzerland is wealthy. North Dakota has no large cities.

But, as I've said before, high capacity clips are a problem. They are offensive weapons that have a limited peaceful or protective use.
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